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Author: tgrmn Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 37583  
Subject: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 4:07 PM
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President Bush is now, IIUC, the first Commander in Chief to do a trap landing on a carrier riding an ejection seat.

How many wires after the #4 wire? I don't know, I'm Air Force and we only ever have one wire on a runway that I know of.

'Tigerman'
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Author: CAVSCT94 Two stars, 250 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16094 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 4:12 PM
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The cynics are going to call this a publicity stunt but it impresses the hell out of me! If anything, it shows the Commander in Chief trusts his military...

Bush = +10 cool points in my book.

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Author: tgrmn Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16095 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 4:18 PM
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"The cynics are going to call this a publicity stunt but it impresses the hell out of me! If anything, it shows the Commander in Chief trusts his military...

Bush = +10 cool points in my book."
----------------------------

This is a far cry from back when we were ordered not to ridicule the CIC.
I've heard some who don't agree with his domestic agenda, but I've never heard anyone say they though he wasn't sincere.

'Tigerman'



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Author: BrerBear Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16096 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 4:57 PM
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How many wires after the #4 wire? I don't know, I'm Air Force and we only ever have one wire on a runway that I know of.

'Tigerman'


Hmmmm... interesting... assuming that the news account was counting from the 1st avail snag, I'd say he was pretty much out of wires...

The pilot was probably doing his best to make a really smooth impact with the Lincoln, and was extra-shallow in his glide slope approach...

Oh well, had he missed the 4th, it's "pour the coals to it" and go around... an 'E' ride I'm sure...

This is a far cry from back when we were ordered not to ridicule the CIC.

Why, whatever can you MEAN?... you can't mean William Jefferson, now can you?.... Gawd I give thanks that my service didn't cover the time he was in office... BB

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Author: tgrmn Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16097 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 6:08 PM
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I hear you BB.... Those were some memorable years for all the wrong reasons. Nothing like the Reagan and Bush years.

I'm thinking he aimed for the #4 wire for fantail insurance and to cushion the bump.



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Author: SirYoda Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16098 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 6:47 PM
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Hmmmm... interesting... assuming that the news account was counting from the 1st avail snag, I'd say he was pretty much out of wires...
--------------

From CNN: The jet made what is known as a "tailhook" landing in which the plane, traveling about 150 mph, hooked onto one of four steel wires across the flight deck and came to a complete stop in less than 400 feet. (emphasis added)

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/05/01/sprj.irq.main/index.html

It doesn't say he caught the #4 wire, note. Anyone see a source that SPECIFICALLY mentions a trap on the 4th wire???

Yoda

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Author: tgrmn Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16099 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 6:59 PM
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"It doesn't say he caught the #4 wire, note. Anyone see a source that SPECIFICALLY mentions a trap on the 4th wire???" Yoda
-------------------------------

I watched it on the news video, does that count? It sure does take awhile for those turbofans to wind back up... but he wasn't a 'bolter'...

<VBG>

'Tigerman'

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Author: CAVSCT94 Two stars, 250 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16101 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/1/2003 10:51 PM
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>>> I hear you BB.... Those were some memorable years for all the wrong reasons. Nothing like the Reagan and Bush years

I recall only being able to start our tanks once each week for 20 minutes or so due to budget shortfalls. We went C3 for training and funds. Our Operational Readiness Rate tanked as we couldn't get spare parts.

My Battalion Commander at the time told us the following: "You know what tankers are without tanks? Infantrymen. Get your rucksacks."

Tankers dismounted in fire team wedges... now there's a sight.

Yes, the President Clinton years were truly something...


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Author: BrerBear Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16105 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 7:34 AM
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It doesn't say he caught the #4 wire, note. Anyone see a source that SPECIFICALLY mentions a trap on the 4th wire???

Yoda


Good question... I read t-man's post before I saw the video on TV, and it did appear that only the last cable was picked up...

The below is one article that also noted the point... [I saw another one yesterday, but darned if I can relocate it...]

http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/news/5768198.htm
President salutes sailors: `One victory' in terror war
HE DROPS IN ON WARSHIP STEAMING HOME TO SAN DIEGO
By Diego Ibarguen
Mercury News Washington Bureau


With news cameras broadcasting live, the president's plane made two passes over the carrier before roaring to a safe landing. Its tail hook snagged the last of four cables on the carrier's deck, jolting his plane from 150 mph to a complete stop within about 400 feet.

BB.

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Author: TMFBarmin Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16106 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 9:10 AM
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I was watching CBS this morning and Harry Smith was interviewing the pilot. Harry mentioned that some people where criticizing his landing, the four wire is the last one.

His reply was something to the effect of, "To all those arm chair LSO's out there, it was an OK 4 wire, and I am sticking to that."

Considering the pressure he was under, he did a great job, and I think the arm chair pilots, who were not attempting the first ever Carrier landing of POTUS, on live TV to boot, should just put a sock in it.

Curt

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Author: hundriver Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16108 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 10:36 AM
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the Lincoln has had more than 12,700 takeoffs and arrested landings in the past nine months without incident. ``If it was not safe, it would not be done,' said White House press secretary Ari Fleischer.

Now there is some PR spin!!!

Of course its not safe. That's why pilots get flight pay.

When an Air Force officer is introduced it goes something like this:

"I'm pleased to introduce Col. John Smith, he is a command pilot with over 5,000 hours flying time and 83 combat missions over North Vietnam . . . "


When a Naval flight officer is introduced it goes like this:

"I'm pleased to introduce Capt. John Smith, he is a command pilot with over 5,000 hours flying time and 83 combat missions over North Vietnam, and over 500 carrier landings. . . "

Where was it I read that the blood pressure in the Naval pilot making a carrier approach rises well above his blood pressure while flying in combat.

Safe? I don't think so.

Hundriver
who always makes a flare before touchdown



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Author: VodounGroove Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16110 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 12:10 PM
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The cynics are going to call this a publicity stunt but it impresses the hell out of me!

Of course it is (he *is* in politics, after all), but I agree - it's one of the coolest publicity stunts I've ever seen. +20 for style.

Kaiti


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Author: Veloci Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16111 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 2:11 PM
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<"it was an OK 4 wire">

Hmmmm...As I recall, from friends, the #1 wire is "OH $&*#!"; the #2 wire is, " Oops..."; the @3, : Good Landing!"; and the #4 wire..."OH $&*# !".

Veloci
P.S. Any landing you walk away from is a good one. :)


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Author: robbiv Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16112 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 3:08 PM
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And a great landing is one where you can reuse the aircraft

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Author: omadhaun Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16115 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 3:48 PM
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When was the last time a Navy pilot piloted Air Force 1?

Just curious.

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Author: iseek2 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16117 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 4:16 PM
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The next wire after the 4th one is the one they send that starts with:

We regret to inform you........

B

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Author: SirYoda Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16120 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 4:55 PM
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When was the last time a Navy pilot piloted Air Force 1?

Just curious.

------------------------------

Never, as far as I know.

And, for this flight, the bird he was in was Navy 1. (His helo is Marine 1).

Yoda

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Author: jiml8 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 16121 of 37583
Subject: Re: #4 wire trap... welcome aboard Date: 5/2/2003 9:36 PM
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This morning on the Neal Boortz radio show, Neal was laughing about that #4 wire and saying that probably the pilot was getting ribbed about it. He then invited navy pilots to call in and explain it to him.

One caller sounded very knowledgeable and claimed to be a test pilot with over 1600 carrier landings, including many in the S3. He says that, although the #3 wire is the desired one, the #4 wire is very frequently the one that the S3 catches because of the glide slope of the S3. It is a clean plane with a high lift wing and tends to get "ground effect" coming over the threshold on the carrier, which flattens out the glide in the last few feet. Because of that, the S3 has spoilers on the top of the wing to kill lift. On the videotape, you can see the spoilers come up as the plane comes over the threshold.

According to this guy, the landing was well done and routine.

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