UnThreaded | Threaded | Whole Thread (6) | Ignore Thread Prev Thread | Next Thread
Author: talullah Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 75378  
Subject: 401K Inquities Date: 9/24/1998 12:02 PM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
Have been tracking 2 401Ks via internet, mine and my husbands. Same funds, same allocations, similar amounts. Same day results his will gain mine will lose. Cannot get direct answers from financial service. What should I do?
Print the post Back To Top
Author: TMFPixy Big gold star, 5000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 5614 of 75378
Subject: Re: 401K Inquities Date: 9/24/1998 4:58 PM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
Greetings, Talullah, and welcome. You asked:

Have been tracking 2 401Ks via internet, mine and my husbands. Same funds, same allocations, similar amounts. Same day results his will gain mine will lose. Cannot get direct answers from financial service. What should I do?

You can try putting the question in writing to the service you're using. Outline how you're checking, what you and your husband are contributing, and when those deductions occur. Ask for an explanation of the differences in your accounts. However, be aware there are a number of reasons why the two plans may be different from day to day. The expenses in the two 401k plans may be different, which would cause the share values to differ. The deposits to each account even if identical and deducted from your checks on the same day may arrive in your accounts on different days, which also affects share values. Rarely will the share values in your accounts be the same as that you see for the same funds posted on the internet. Often those funds will have a totally different expense structure within the 401k plan. I suspicion one or more of these reasons will explain the difference, but you should get that confirmed in writing from your service or plan administrator(s).

Regards…..Pixy


Print the post Back To Top
Author: talullah Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 5622 of 75378
Subject: Re: 401K Inquities Date: 9/24/1998 8:29 PM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
Thank you so much, Pixy. Your explanation is more than I have gotten in seven long weeks of trying with my plan administrator.

Print the post Back To Top
Author: shess Two stars, 250 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 5634 of 75378
Subject: Re: 401K Inquities Date: 9/25/1998 1:30 PM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
talullah wrote:
<<Have been tracking 2 401Ks via internet, mine and my husbands. Same funds, same allocations, similar amounts. Same day results his will gain mine will lose.>>

In addition to Pixy's points, keep in mind that often what you can purchase within a 401(k) LOOKS exactly the same as something outside the 401(k), but it really isn't. Lots of regular funds have 401(k) twins, which are vaguely related, but aren't the same. In addition, I wouldn't be surprised if different 401(k) plans with the exact same offerings in them wouldn't actually have subtle differences which No Mere Mortal can comprehend.


rant=on

BTW, I really dislike the 401(k) concept's implementation for these reasons and others. Sometimes, you get lucky and have an excellent plan, but often you're getting ripped off by all parties involved. It doesn't have to be that way. My wife has been part of various 401(k) plans, while I'm self-employed and so use a SEP-IRA. The differences are _appalling_. The SEP-IRA expenses are low, I can track my account without having to read through various gobbledigook, and there aren't three organizations trying to pawn fees off on me.

If we can come up with a simple, transparent, cheap retirement system for companies of _one_, it's hard to believe we couldn't come with something better when we're talking about companies with hundreds and thousands of workers.

rant=off

Later,
scott


Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Print the post Back To Top
Author: TMFPixy Big gold star, 5000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 5655 of 75378
Subject: Re: 401K Inquities Date: 9/26/1998 11:03 AM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
Scott says:

BTW, I really dislike the 401(k) concept's implementation for these reasons and others. Sometimes, you get lucky and have an excellent plan, but often you're getting ripped off by all parties involved. It doesn't have to be that way. My wife has been part of various 401(k) plans, while I'm self-employed and so use a SEP-IRA. The differences are _appalling_. The SEP-IRA expenses are low, I can track my account without having to read through various gobbledigook, and there aren't three organizations trying to pawn fees off on me.

If we can come up with a simple, transparent, cheap retirement system for companies of _one_, it's hard to believe we couldn't come with something better when we're talking about companies with hundreds and thousands of workers.


Fortunately, the fees within 401k plans are receiving extensive review by the federal government at long last. Some are unconscionable and outright gouges of participants due to employer inattentiveness and employee disinterest/ignorance. With luck, the DOL will hold employers' feet to the fire so they become more cost conscious in this area. And with luck more employees will become aware of what these fees are doing to their long-term results and begin to demand change. If attacked from both sides, employers will begin to take more responsibility in this neglected area.

Regards….Pixy



Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Print the post Back To Top
Author: shess Two stars, 250 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 5694 of 75378
Subject: Re: 401K Inquities Date: 9/28/1998 12:57 PM
Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Recommendations: 0
In message 5634, Scott said:
BTW, I really dislike the 401(k) concept's implementation for these reasons and others.

In message 5655, Pixy responded:
Fortunately, the fees within 401k plans are receiving extensive review by the federal government at long last. Some are unconscionable and outright gouges of participants due to employer inattentiveness and employee disinterest/ignorance. With luck, the DOL will hold employers' feet to the fire so they become more cost conscious in this area.

Unfortunately, being self-employed, I have no choice but to see this as exactly comparable to the bruhaha (sp? ha!) over health insurance and holding insurer's feet to the fire. The fact that the federal government has to get involved to protect the majority interest is part of the problem! There clearly are better and worse 401(k) plans, but as an employee it can be _very_ hard to find out where your plan stands. All plans claim to be good plans, but even with the best plans it's almost impossible to nail down fees and hidden costs, including a whole range of costs spiritually similar to the "soft money" of the mutual fund arena.

I am positive that most 401(k) participants don't want to know about this stuff. But progress happens at the margins, and so far as I can tell, the 401(k) was created specifically to make the margins obscure. At the time, this may have made sense, but these days, a bit more transparency should be in order. [For instance, what possible employee-centric justification is there for forcing vested 401(k) funds to remain with your employer's 401(k) plan until you change employers?]

"Nurse, I think we need to raise Scott's dosage!",
scott


Post New | Post Reply | Reply Later | Create Poll . Report this Post | Recommend it!
Print the post Back To Top
UnThreaded | Threaded | Whole Thread (6) | Ignore Thread Prev Thread | Next Thread
Advertisement