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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 45066  
Subject: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 8:09 AM
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And we need more guns?


http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/blog/bs-md-c...


"10-year-old struck in New Year's celebratory shooting diesBy Justin George, The Baltimore Sun

10:47 p.m. EST, January 3, 2013
ELKTON —— Aaliyah Boyer had hoped to watch the New Year's ball drop on TV, but when she learned she had missed the stroke of midnight by 32 seconds, she returned to the front yard with her friends to watch her neighbors light fireworks.

Nearby, someone apparently fired a gun into the air to add to the celebration. Amid the jubilation, the 10-year-old fell to the ground, the warmth and color draining from her body after she was hit by a falling bullet. Her family initially thought that she had fainted, but the wound would prove fatal."
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Author: TMFJeanie Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40481 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 2:38 PM
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I've always marveled at this practice when it's shown on TV in all those Arab countries. It's mind-boggling when you see it being done by dozens of celebrating men all at once in the middle of wedding processions.
As my husband, a former army platoon leader in Vietnam always says: "don't these idiots know that what goes up must come down???"

But I had no idea this tradition was so prevalent in the U.S.

In Detroit, Vince said, police helicopters have been grounded on New Year's Eve because so many bullets are fired into the sky that it is considered too dangerous for the crews to be deployed.

What a stupid tradition. I'll never understand why so many gun owners don't practice even the slightest bit of common sense.


Jeanie

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Author: PSUEngineer Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40482 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 4:06 PM
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And we need more alcohol and cars.

Drunk driver kills pregnant woman in Queens
http://www.examiner.com/article/drunk-driver-kills-pregnant-...

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Author: TMFJeanie Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40486 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 5:17 PM
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And we need more alcohol and cars.

Well, since you completely changed the subject, I'll chime in again.

I'll never understand why so many car owners don't practice even the slightest bit of common sense when they choose to drink and then get behind the wheel.

Better?


Jeanie

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Author: Myownigloo Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40487 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 7:37 PM
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Seems to me the answer is to fix stupid.

But you can't fix stupid, right?

What if we made it popular to be smart?

But how?

MOI

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Author: PSUEngineer Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40488 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 8:34 PM
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Well, since you completely changed the subject, I'll chime in again.

Not really. They're related. It was the idiot behind the gun, not the gun's fault in the original post. The guy shot up in the air. It was not an intentional death. The same thing happened in the story I linked but not with a gun. In that incident, alcohol and a motor vehicle was used. Should those things be blamed or should the idiot who drank alcohol and drove the car be at fault?

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Author: malaoshi Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40489 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 9:13 PM
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Guns have only one purpose, PSU, and that is to kill.
That is their purpose.
To kill.
A car is primarily for transportation..and yes it is a dangerous weapon in the wrong hands but it is not primarily to kill.
What other purpose does a gun serve?
To terrorize.
To kill.
And as a "protection," all it does is threaten to kill.

So why do civilians carry guns?

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Author: PSUEngineer Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40490 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 9:54 PM
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What other purpose does a gun serve?

I have a lot of fun target shooting.

Plus you missed the analogy in my post. Both were accidents. I purposely picked an accident. If he had picked a story of an intentional shooting, it would be different.

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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40491 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 10:24 PM
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"And we need more alcohol and cars."

You'll get no argument out of me if there was a ban on alcohol. I drink one beer a week at most. If they banned beer, so be it.

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Author: malaoshi Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40492 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/4/2013 11:05 PM
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Yes, PSU, I missed your analogy. The subtlety of it escaped me.

Throwing darts in a pub can be fun. You can win lots of points, cheers, and slaps on the back. Or ;) you could try a boomerang...

Target shooting merely proves how efficiently you could kill someone....

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Author: knighttof3 Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40493 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/5/2013 2:22 AM
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Malaoshi: What other purpose does a gun serve?

PSU: I have a lot of fun target shooting.

Plus you missed the analogy in my post. Both were accidents. I purposely picked an accident. If he had picked a story of an intentional shooting, it would be different.


I could have a lot of fun blowing up stuff using dynamite. Why can't I carry dynamite sticks in my car and store them in my house? How about rocket launchers and grenades and cannons and tanks? You are restricting my freedom by not letting me have any bombs.

A country that strictly regulates the size of the toilet tank but allows guns for practically everyone is a schizophrenic country.

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Author: PSUEngineer Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40494 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/5/2013 9:06 AM
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Target shooting merely proves how efficiently you could kill someone....

Target shooting is also an Olympic sport. If you don't like it, don't do it but don't say killing is the only purpose of guns.

PSU

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Author: discurro Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40495 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/5/2013 9:30 AM
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you missed the analogy in my post. Both were accidents. I purposely picked an accident. If he had picked a story of an intentional shooting, it would be different.

Well, if you wanted a true analogy, you should have found a story where someone was killed by the honking of the car horn at midnight. In both cases, it would have been where the owner recklessly used the tool as a noise maker.

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Author: GardenStateFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40496 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/5/2013 9:52 AM
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Target shooting is also an Olympic sport. If you don't like it, don't do it but don't say killing is the only purpose of guns.

Maybe it would be clearer to say that guns were invented for the purpose of killing. Both for food and for war.

That they have later been adapted to other things still doesn't mitigate the fact that all of the subsequent uses of guns are strictly to sharpen the skill set necessary for its original purpose. There's no other way to productively use a gun.

My kids love archery. But I don't for a moment forget (nor should anyone) that these things are weapons and are designed for the purpose of inflicting wounds, preferably fatal.

I can't think of any other class of objects that falls into that category, even knives. Those are designed for the purpose of cutting and chopping things, but not necessarily things that are flesh.

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Author: lovingrose Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40497 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/5/2013 3:09 PM
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I'll never understand why so many car owners don't practice even the slightest bit of common sense when they choose to drink and then get behind the wheel.

***************
And why so many cops and judges let them off to do it again.

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Author: feedmeNOWhuman Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40498 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 12:21 AM
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You'll get no argument out of me if there was a ban on alcohol. I drink one beer a week at most. If they banned beer, so be it.





I wonder if that was ever tried before, and if so, how well it worked.

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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40499 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 9:03 AM
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"I wonder if that was ever tried before, and if so, how well it worked."

They can do whatever they want - I don't care if alcohol is banned. if I was smart, I would have invested the $ I spent in bars when I was in college and in my 20's. Would have far more to show for it than a bunch of hangovers.

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40501 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 10:13 AM
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I'll never understand why so many car owners don't practice even the slightest bit of common sense when they choose to drink and then get behind the wheel.

Amen to that! Yesterday, we were on a PGR mission in Livingston, TX. It was cold, wet and miserable. The perfect day to say goodbye to a fallen soldier.

Except, the 22 yr old soldier, who did a tour of Iraq as a National Guard member and was back in the States, was totally responsible for his own death. Alcohol, combined with no seatbelt, and a rollover in his car, left his 17 month old daughter without a father.

Tragic and completely preventable.

LWW

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40502 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 10:20 AM
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So why do civilians carry guns?

Because we live in a world were people will seek you out to do harm to you.

http://loganville.patch.com/articles/loganville-woman-shoots...

Short synopsis: woman calls the police because of a burglary in progress. She grabs her kids and they hide in the attic crawl space. Burglar finds them. As a last resort, she shoots said burglar 5 times. He runs away and is caught by the police after wrecking his car. He's in critical condition.


Just as soon as we figure out a way to stop criminals from committing crimes, I'll gladly give up my gun. Until then, I'll keep my protection, thanks.

LWW

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Author: JoshRandall Big gold star, 5000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40503 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 11:00 AM
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Gee, what is happening to the Open Letter board? It used to be a place where politics was not discussed. Sigh.

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Author: alstroemeria Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40504 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 1:27 PM
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Target shooting is also an Olympic sport.

So is biathlon. Picture it, skiers with loaded rifles...outta my way! (Didn't they do that in a James Bond movie...one of the Roger Moores?)

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Author: alstroemeria Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40505 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 1:30 PM
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Gee, what is happening to the Open Letter board? It used to be a place where politics was not discussed. Sigh.
JoshRandall


heh. Just pick a few of your AOL posts at random ;-)

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Author: BigKahoona Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40506 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 1:50 PM
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if I was smart,

I know, right?

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40507 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 10:43 PM
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I wonder if that was ever tried before, and if so, how well it worked.

Yet you think a ban on guns will work. Pffft!

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Author: pixiecakes Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40508 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/6/2013 11:16 PM
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Short synopsis: woman calls the police because of a burglary in progress. She grabs her kids and they hide in the attic crawl space. Burglar finds them. As a last resort, she shoots said burglar 5 times. He runs away and is caught by the police after wrecking his car. He's in critical condition.

She shot him five times at close range and he was still able to run away? Was she using a cap gun?

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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40509 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 6:29 AM
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"She shot him five times at close range and he was still able to run away? Was she using a cap gun?"

So much for quality control at gun manufacturers. You can't even buy a decent gun anymore - sheesh!

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40510 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 8:30 AM
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She shot him five times at close range and he was still able to run away? Was she using a cap gun?

I wondered the same thing. Most likely, her hubby got her a "nice little gun" for protection thinking that she could slip it in her purse and most likely would never actually have to use it.

I practiced with a Sig Sauer 380 (I have no idea how that's supposed to be written) over the break. It was smaller and fit my hand well, but has enough stopping power that I might consider getting one.

Right now the only handgun we have in the house is DH's Glock and I'd be better off just clocking someone upaide the head with it, rather than trying to fire it.

LWW

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Author: qazulight Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40511 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 8:58 AM
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I picked up a judge ultra light. Equipped with 2 1/2 inch 410 shot gun shells with self defense loading it should stop most thin skinned animals. For something armored like hogs, the shells would have to be rotated with colt 45 armor penetrating rounds.

I still don't have one, but I really want the tracker, one with a 5 inch barrel.

I looked at the Raging Judge, a 454 magnum version. It weighs something like 4 pounds. I figured if I could use it, I wouldn't need it, I would just bust out of clothes turn green and terrorize the poor intruder.

"Don't make me angry, you wouldn't like me when I am angry."

Cheers
Qazulight

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40512 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 12:13 PM
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I picked up a judge ultra light. Equipped with 2 1/2 inch 410 shot gun shells with self defense loading it should stop most thin skinned animals. For something armored like hogs, the shells would have to be rotated with colt 45 armor penetrating rounds.

The guy at Academy tried to sell me a Judge. Call me crazy, for a variety of reasons ;), but I just don't like the idea of using a hand-held shotgun for home defense. The kick has got to be horrible and I don't want to be picking pellets out of the wall later on.

We do have a nice aluminum bat in DH's closet, and to be honest, I think a #1 strike (Arnis training) with that would probably do enough damage to allow me to subdue the intruder and call the cops.

LWW

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Author: anuvaka Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40513 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 1:56 PM
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I deliberatly stayed away from posting because this has very pointed radical views from both sides.

Look at it this way. It is a Constitutional Right to own a gun.

Not a cannon or a sub-machinegun, just a "gun".

Ownership is a resonsibility, a privledge. Just like driving is. And if you cross the line, the Privledge can be taken away.

The whole idea is to keep the unstable, angry, uncontrolled from owning or having access to a gun. Any gun.

But there is a right to self defense.
"When Life or Death is seconds away, the police will be there in 10 minutes"

I feel no need for a 45 cal, 30 shell, semi-automatic "home defense" weapon. But a shotgun or a Judge will stop or deter any intruder and prevent My death. Where a 38 could penetrate the walls of my house and even the walls of my neighbors house. And they have kids.

I am a fan of gun control. Keeping them locked away, safe. Hitting what you aim at. Keeping them away from unstable people or juveniles.

But don't tell me I can't have a gun. I might just need one someday.
jC

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40515 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 3:24 PM
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I am a fan of gun control. Keeping them locked away, safe. Hitting what you aim at. Keeping them away from unstable people or juveniles.

But don't tell me I can't have a gun. I might just need one someday.


A friend who's a Marine Vet has a patch on his vest: "Gun COntrol. Use both hands"

I don't need an AK47, or an AR15, but I have to admit that I sleep a little better at night knowing that we have one that is locked away from where kids could get to it, but is available if DH needs to grab it.

LWW

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Author: knighttof3 Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40516 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 3:53 PM
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One important consideration: more guns kill more people. I've posted this in other forums, but please read http://mark.reid.name/iem/gun-deaths-vs-gun-ownership.html and look at https://dl.dropbox.com/u/38668/deaths-vs-guns.png.
One on hand we have the Constitution and people's natural desire to retain the rights that they have enjoyed for so long.
On the other hand we have an almost perfect statistical correlation between guns per capita and gun deaths per capita, with a few exceptions like Mexico and North European countries.
If you are a STEM person, the conclusion is obvious. If you want to lower gun deaths, lower the number of guns per head. Correlation may not be causation but in this case you'll have to look very hard to see what else it could be. Switzerland is hardly South-Central Los Angeles or Harlem.
US averages 87 gun deaths a day, with 183 others injured, and a cost of $100 billion per year because of gun injuries. The unpalatable truth is that this number would be lower if the government took away citizens' guns. Now what do you want to do? It's upto you.

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Author: sofaking6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40517 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/7/2013 4:15 PM
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A friend who's a Marine Vet has a patch on his vest: "Gun COntrol. Use both hands"

I don't get what's at all funny or cute or smart about that? I'm not opposed to people owning guns, but this careless, scoffing attitude is likely to make me rethink that. It's gun owners like this who insist that it be all or nothing - if we don't let mental patients have nukes, we're COMMIES!

6

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Author: malaoshi Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40518 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 12:37 AM
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I came to America as a newly-wed Brit. Living in London, I thought of Bobbies ( The London police in those days) as one's friend, there to help you, point the way, joke about the drizzle, etc etc...

My second day, Cambridge Mass, I saw an American policeman, and he was wearing a GUN. I had never seen a gun close up. I was horrified. I gaped at the gun.

He saw my face, probably thought I was gaping at his butt, and he moved away...no smile, no acknowledgement, nothing.

I haven't checked but I wonder how many other police forces in the first world countries carry guns. It doesn't seem the sign of a civilized nation, but maybe I was suffering from culture shock.

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Author: discurro Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40519 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 8:12 AM
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My second day, Cambridge Mass, I saw an American policeman, and he was wearing a GUN. I had never seen a gun close up. I was horrified. I gaped at the gun.

He saw my face, probably thought I was gaping at his butt, and he moved away...no smile, no acknowledgement, nothing.


try smiling and waving first. most cops are very personable if you give them the chance, but they get so much crap from some people that they generally start out "guarded". I am not a big fan of guns, but for the most part, I am a fan of the police.

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40521 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 12:02 PM
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It's gun owners like this who insist that it be all or nothing - if we don't let mental patients have nukes, we're COMMIES!

You'd be hard pressed to find a vertan who is in favor of gun control, but I think it's a bit of a stretch to suggest that they would support mental patients having nuclear weapons.

I am in favor of some limited control, but not so much the guns as the people who are allowed to own them. When you have to force someone to take medication in order to be lucid enough to be brought to trial for a gun crime, you have to wonder how such a person was able to get a gun in the first place.

I just don't think the problem is as simple as cutting out guns. It's like all the zero tolerance policies that get passed in the school systems. Then you have a kindergartener get suspended for making a gun with his hand.

LWW

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Author: sofaking6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40522 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 12:26 PM
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When you have to force someone to take medication in order to be lucid enough to be brought to trial for a gun crime, you have to wonder how such a person was able to get a gun in the first place.

Um, because of people who think that "gun control" means "use both hands".

I just don't think the problem is as simple as cutting out guns.

See? That isn't at all what I said. I say "some regulation" and you hear "cut out guns". How can a dialog happen like this? Answer: it can't.

6

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Author: PSUEngineer Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40523 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 12:35 PM
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See? That isn't at all what I said. I say "some regulation" and you hear "cut out guns". How can a dialog happen like this? Answer: it can't.

She may be answering to more than one post. While you say some regulation, posters such as knighttof3 on this thread are saying cut out guns.

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Author: R0TJob Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40525 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 12:40 PM
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See? That isn't at all what I said. I say "some regulation" and you hear "cut out guns". How can a dialog happen like this? Answer:

Tittysprinkles.

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40526 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 1:04 PM
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See? That isn't at all what I said. I say "some regulation" and you hear "cut out guns". How can a dialog happen like this? Answer: it can't.

No, actually, what I was pointing out that I keep hearing here and iin other places is that "cut out the guns" as the be all end all answer. I didn't say that you said that. Sorry if you misunderstood me.

However, in what you did write, I was reading the suggestion that gun owners were in favor of giving the mentally ill nukes. Which kinda comes off as some pretty extreme hyperbole.

LWW

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Author: THEMATHISNEAR Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40528 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 2:51 PM
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It's gun owners like this who insist that it be all or nothing - if we don't let mental patients have nukes, we're COMMIES!

Uh, what? That's quite a non sequitur, given that posters earlier in this thread said specifically that they want to keep guns OUT of the hands of the unstable.

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Author: sofaking6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40530 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 3:27 PM
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However, in what you did write, I was reading the suggestion that gun owners were in favor of giving the mentally ill nukes. Which kinda comes off as some pretty extreme hyperbole.

But that's *exactly* what that phrase means, isn't it? Gun control = use both hands?

6

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Author: BigKahoona Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40531 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 3:40 PM
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However, in what you did write, I was reading the suggestion that gun owners were in favor of giving the mentally ill nukes.


That's just crazy talk.

The mentally ill should have to pay for their nukes like everybody else.

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Author: MichaelRead Big gold star, 5000 posts Feste Award Winner! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40533 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 4:46 PM
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Hdere's the police use of weapons in Britain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_police_firearms_in_the_...

MIchaelR (also an ex-Brit)

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40534 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 5:27 PM
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But that's *exactly* what that phrase means, isn't it? Gun control = use both hands?

Obviously, you are speaking a language I am not familiar with. How does a sarcastic patch about gun control come off as an endorsement for giving nuclear weapons to the mentally ill?

LWW

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Author: ishtarastarte Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40536 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 6:06 PM
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You'd be hard pressed to find a vertan who is in favor of gun control, but I think it's a bit of a stretch to suggest that they would support mental patients having nuclear weapons.


Really?

Ishtar
(veteran for some gun control)

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Author: ChiliChild Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40537 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 6:29 PM
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You'd be hard pressed to find a vertan who is in favor of gun control,


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/08/stanley-mcchrystal-...

From today's newsfeed:

Said McChrystal, "I personally don't think there's any need for that kind of weaponry on the streets and particularly around the schools in America. I believe that we've got to take a serious look -- I understand everybody's desire to have whatever they want -- but we have to protect our children and our police and we have to protect our population. And I think we have to take a very mature look at that."

Chili

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Author: sofaking6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40538 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/8/2013 6:29 PM
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Obviously, you are speaking a language I am not familiar with. How does a sarcastic patch about gun control come off as an endorsement for giving nuclear weapons to the mentally ill?

Oh, it's sarcastic is it? The person who wears it really does support gun control then?

6

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Author: bighairymike Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40540 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/9/2013 12:00 AM
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If you want to lower gun deaths, lower the number of guns per head. Correlation may not be causation but in this case you'll have to look very hard to see what else it could be.

-------------

What else? It my be hard to grasp but maybe it is the number of criminals, not the number of guns. And the causes for the rise in the number of criminals is a result of all sorts of overlapping causes, such as violence in video games, glamorization of the gansta lifestyle in music and videos, the breakdown of the nuclear family especially in the black community, the failed war on drugs, and so on.

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Author: bryanstryin Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40542 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/9/2013 8:53 AM
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Take a few minutes and watch this, it is worth the time investment. Pay close attention to the statistics related to crime as well as the types of crime.
I would suggest you send it to other people you know and try to get the broadest possible distribution.

This is right around the corner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=fGaDAThOHhA

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Author: knighttof3 Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40544 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/9/2013 12:38 PM
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If you want to lower gun deaths, lower the number of guns per head. Correlation may not be causation but in this case you'll have to look very hard to see what else it could be.

-------------

What else? It my be hard to grasp but maybe it is the number of criminals, not the number of guns. And the causes for the rise in the number of criminals is a result of all sorts of overlapping causes, such as violence in video games, glamorization of the gansta lifestyle in music and videos, the breakdown of the nuclear family especially in the black community, the failed war on drugs, and so on.


This conclusion is not supported by facts or logic.

Based on fact: Why do Canada and Switzerland have higher deaths per capita, caused by guns, than Japan or UK?

Based on logic: Kids acting gangsta ("tough") is nothing new. If those kids (for example, in black communities that you site) did not have guns, they wouldn't be able to kill as casually as they can now.

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Author: bighairymike Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40545 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/9/2013 6:17 PM
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Based on logic: Kids acting gangsta ("tough") is nothing new. If those kids (for example, in black communities that you site) did not have guns, they wouldn't be able to kill as casually as they can now.

---------------

Have to agree with you there. But that is no real world solution because they will have guns anyway.

Lets ban crack and meth while we are at it? We don't need those in the ghetto either.

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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40554 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/10/2013 10:40 PM
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From the "you know attitudes towards gus are changing" department:

"Steve and Amber Mostyn, wealthy Texas lawyers who donated millions to help elect Democrats last year, are giving $1 million to a new gun control super PAC created by former Arizona congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords and her husband, Mark Kelly."

Huh? I thought everyone in Texas carried a gun?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/01/09/gabri...

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Author: BigKahoona Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40556 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/11/2013 8:40 AM
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Huh? I thought everyone in Texas carried a gun?

I bet you also think every guy in West Virginia marries his sister.

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Author: discurro Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40557 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/11/2013 12:59 PM
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I bet you also think every guy in West Virginia marries his sister.

Don't be ridiculous. Sometimes they will go as far afield as a first cousin or livestock.

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Author: InconclusiveFool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40558 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/11/2013 9:03 PM
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"I bet you also think every guy in West Virginia marries his sister."

You're not the first one who told me that.

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Author: joycets Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40608 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/18/2013 2:22 AM
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Guns (cars, etc) don't kill people, Physics kills people.

jts


(yeah, physics is involved in alcohol & drugs, its just wrapped up in biochemistry which is also a physical process).

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Author: joycets Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40609 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/18/2013 2:33 AM
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I am in favor of some limited control, but not so much the guns as the people who are allowed to own them. When you have to force someone to take medication in order to be lucid enough to be brought to trial for a gun crime, you have to wonder how such a person was able to get a gun in the first place.

Try considering that they might trade the medication they aren't taking for the guns, eh? Or similar adaptive behavior ( I could call it maladaptive, but in some situations what might seem maladaptive is valid to the people living it).

joycets (posting based in part on what a close friend told me, not that she did any of this, but hinted it would be easy).

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Author: Retrograde Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40610 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/18/2013 3:08 AM
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Guns (cars, etc) don't kill people, Physics kills people.

BAN ALL PHYSICS!!!

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Author: Myownigloo Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40612 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/18/2013 10:24 AM
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Guns (cars, etc) don't kill people, Physics kills people.

Yeah, physics. And sometimes colonics and enemas.

MOI

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 40614 of 45066
Subject: Re: An Open Letter Date: 1/18/2013 12:42 PM
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Try considering that they might trade the medication they aren't taking for the guns, eh? Or similar adaptive behavior ( I could call it maladaptive, but in some situations what might seem maladaptive is valid to the people living it).

Always a possibility, however, the cases I was thinking of were people who were reported to have legally purchased the guns they used.

It goes without saying that criminals will always have guns, no matter how strick the gun laws are.

LWW

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