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Author: jamesp717 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 156914  
Subject: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/17/2012 6:35 AM
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The Bing Challenge


http://www.bingiton.com/Landingpage.aspx?form=MBIOST&pub...



James
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Author: Goofyhoofy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155881 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/17/2012 8:38 AM
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I took the challenge a few days ago. Twice. It was fairly unimpressive, the results were so similar it was hard to decide which was "better" sometimes. (Perhaps that's a victory, but it didn't convince me to switch permanently.)

The first time I came out 3 for Google and 2 for Bing, and got the line "Most people choose Bing" or some such. The second time it was two ties, 2 for Bing, 1 for Google, and the line was "See? People choose Bing two to one over Google." (paraphrase). But all I could think of was "No, I didn't choose Bring two to one, I chose it 2 out of 5."

On a couple of the questions I was able to figure tt which was which because of the layout. The result had "subheads" as Google sometimes does, but the Bing result did not.

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155882 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/17/2012 9:51 PM
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I don't get the point of the site.

Why is the typical consumer going to invest in time for a Microsoft advertising experiment? Why would they even go to the site? It reminds me of the Pepsi challenge they used to do back in the 80s, only they had prizes or at least pins and they would flag you down at the Mall.

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Author: Goofyhoofy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155883 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/17/2012 11:03 PM
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Why is the typical consumer going to invest in time for a Microsoft advertising experiment? Why would they even go to the site? It reminds me of the Pepsi challenge they used to do back in the 80s, only they had prizes or at least pins and they would flag you down at the Mall.

I'm sure they will get tens of thousands of hits, after which they will trumpet the results (assuming they're favorable) or bury them (if not.)

It's not going to amount to anything, however, because the difference is neglible. When Google appears it was so demonstrably superior to the alternatives (Yahoo, Alta Vista, etc.) that people naturally flowed to it; Bing has no such clear cut advantage. If they're going to grow their base they're going to have to find some other way to do it. (I have an idea for that, or two, but who knows if they would be successful?)

I don't get the point of the site.

Somebody thinks "Ours is better! Really!" is a winning strategy. As the success of McDonald's Not better), Betamax (better), and the Bic ballpoint pen (not better) attest, it ain't necessarily so.
 


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Author: jamesp717 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155884 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/17/2012 11:21 PM
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Bic ballpoint pen (not better) attest, it ain't necessarily so.



Still buy and use Bic pens, you cant get a better pen for the money. a pack of 10 was under 2 bucks, as for the Bic disposable razor, they should have stuck with pens.


James

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155885 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/18/2012 2:33 AM
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Somebody thinks "Ours is better! Really!" is a winning strategy. 


Yeah... I just disagree with that somebody. Sounds like you do too.

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Author: dsbrady Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155887 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/18/2012 3:45 PM
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It reminds me of the Pepsi challenge they used to do back in the 80s, only they had prizes or at least pins and they would flag you down at the Mall.

Not to mention maybe the chance of being in one of the commercials . . . .

I did it as a kid, and I think I just wanted the free drinks of soda. :)

dsbrady

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Author: javbaseball Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155888 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/23/2012 8:52 AM
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The point of the site is to get people to try Bing. Most people use google and never think to change they just keep using it. Bing will get millions of hits and some people will start using it that never would have. They don't have to be that much better they just have to be better in some peoples minds. Most of the people that switch will continue to use bing at least for a while. I thought about using that site for a while just to get more results at one time.

As for the Pepsi challenge, I read people picked Pepsi in the challenge and some people switched but after a short period people switched back to Coke. Could happen with this also.

Jerry

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Author: TMFFrank One star, 50 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155890 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/23/2012 12:34 PM
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"I'm sure they will get tens of thousands of hits, after which they will trumpet the results (assuming they're favorable) or bury them (if not.)

It's not going to amount to anything, however, because the difference is neglible. When Google appears it was so demonstrably superior to the alternatives (Yahoo, Alta Vista, etc.) that people naturally flowed to it; Bing has no such clear cut advantage. If they're going to grow their base they're going to have to find some other way to do it. (I have an idea for that, or two, but who knows if they would be successful?)"

The game is rigged, too. The google side doesn't register its sidebars, where google has moved much of its content. So, if you search for a product, Bing will show price comparisons from various sellers, but results from Google's price comparison engine (which used to have the coolest name ever -- Froogal) is suspiciously absent because those results appear slightly to the right of the main list. Apparently, "Bing it On" has no peripheral vision.

Further, the test doesn't measure the "learning" ability of either engine. A search engine gets better as it learns your preferences. When I search "Fred" on Google, my top result is the Federal Reserve Economic Database because Google has figured out I'm an economics and investing nerd.

But, with Bing it On, the search queries are coming from servers in Redmond, so Google doesn't recognize me. If I search "Fred" during the challenge, both sites turn up the facebook profile of some guy in Michigan and a few youtube videos about a cartoon... a cartoon named fred.

That ability to learn is far more important than what either engine can do with a given query. Kind of why search is a natural monopoly.

If I were a Google shareholder, I'd be more worried about Wolfram Alpha, which is legitimately disruptive.

Thanks,
Frank

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155891 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/23/2012 6:17 PM
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The point of the site is to get people to try Bing. Most people use google and never think to change they just keep using it. Bing will get millions of hits and some people will start using it that never would have.

Why would people go there? What would motivate a person to go to "BingItOn"? Unless you are unhappy with Google results, there is no incentive to go spend 10 minutes doodling around on what is clearly a promotional site, you can't even win a prize.

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Author: Goofyhoofy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155892 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/23/2012 9:31 PM
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Further, the test doesn't measure the "learning" ability of either engine. A search engine gets better as it learns your preferences.

True enough, but I wonder how many people are "signed on" to Google so it knows your preferences. Surely many people are work aren't logged in to G-mail, since they have their own corporate accounts. And lots of uses at home bounce between AOL, Yahoo, and Google, so I wonder if they're in that pool?

Regardless it's a big competitive advantage, I'll admit.

Data from the NPD group showed that while 10-14 percent of US households now have a Mac, only 2 percent are mac only. Considering that about 1 percent are linux only, this means that 97 percent of US households have some sort of Windows machine running at home.

You're talking about "penetration." I was talking about "marketshare", which is generally a reference to the last 12 months (or whatever appropriate period is being measured) sales.

nobody can deny Microsoft still has a truly extraordinary amount of leverage

Yes they do. Can they use it? That's the question. Sometimes corporations can take assets and leverage them into new and related markets: Procter & Gamble, Kellogg's, Coca-Cola and others. Sometimes they have leverage and can't: Schlitz Beer had the #1 market position, biggest ad budget, best distribution, and... remember them?

If Microsoft is going to win here it will be because of Office, not because of Windows 8. But nobody is going to use Office (to any meaningful degree) on a cell phone, so they will have to leverage Office into tablets, and then from the user experience of 8 backwards into the handheld space. That's a tricky - and long - path to take.

Conceivably they could do very well in tablets while falling on their nose in phones. Absent some other sort of "leverage" I wouldn't be at all surprised to see that as the outcome. I note that "Tablets" is good; "cell phones" is better. (Faster turnover, higher margin, wider audience.)

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Author: TMFFrank One star, 50 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155893 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/24/2012 1:35 PM
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"Yes they do. Can they use it? That's the question. Sometimes corporations can take assets and leverage them into new and related markets: Procter & Gamble, Kellogg's, Coca-Cola and others. Sometimes they have leverage and can't: Schlitz Beer had the #1 market position, biggest ad budget, best distribution, and... remember them?

If Microsoft is going to win here it will be because of Office, not because of Windows 8. But nobody is going to use Office (to any meaningful degree) on a cell phone, so they will have to leverage Office into tablets, and then from the user experience of 8 backwards into the handheld space. That's a tricky - and long - path to take."


I could see value in having a more outlook-friendly mobile email client and a mobile version of OneNote, but your point is well taken.

From a broader perspective, it's pretty clear (and commonly stated) that the focus going forward will be on integrating multiple devices. For me, the question is which device will be the keystone of that system? If it turns out to be the PC, they should be pretty well positioned, but as you say, there's still no guarantee having a laptop with Windows or Office will make a windows phone attractive. Better Sharepoint and Lync integration could add value for business types. Some features that work with the xBox 360 might add appeal for consumers, but nobody really knows what will/won't work.

I agree that MSFT's first step is getting a decent tablet out there. Personally, I'm really excited about the Surface Pro. If the digitizer is as good as I've heard (apparently, it's just like writing on paper, great for handwritten notes, etc..) and the performance doesn't suck, I'll trade in my iPad for one.

"You're talking about "penetration." I was talking about "marketshare", which is generally a reference to the last 12 months (or whatever appropriate period is being measured) sales."

Yep, that number makes sense now. Thanks for clearing it up.

Thanks,
Frank

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Author: dsbrady Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155894 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/24/2012 2:05 PM
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a mobile version of OneNote

For what it's worth, there is a mobile version of OneNote (on the iPhone; I presume it's also on Android).

dsbrady

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Author: TMFFrank One star, 50 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155895 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/24/2012 2:42 PM
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Yep, I use it for the iPad. It's better than nothing, but not by much.

Frank

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Author: javbaseball Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155899 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/25/2012 2:30 PM
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Why would people go there? What would motivate a person to go to "BingItOn"? Unless you are unhappy with Google results, there is no incentive to go spend 10 minutes doodling around on what is clearly a promotional site, you can't even win a prize.



I went there just for curiosity sake. 18 million people have gone to this web site http://sadtrombone.com/?play=true for who knows what reason.


Jerry

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155900 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/25/2012 3:27 PM
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Maybe Microsoft should buy sadtrombone.com and turn it into the next bing promo site then. It trends higher on twitter than bingiton.

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Author: Youngandold One star, 50 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155902 of 156914
Subject: Re: Bing taking it to Google Date: 9/25/2012 8:16 PM
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I went to the site after seeing the thread. Bing won 2 to 1.

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