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Author: 2828 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 744148  
Subject: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 8:48 AM
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http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/51152?utm_sourc...

There’s a very entertaining, but terrifying book by Laer Pearce, “Crazifornia: Tales from the Tarnished State—How California is destroying itself and Why It Matters to America.” I recommend everyone read it because it lays out the template for why California will go belly up and why the nation is at the precipice of doing the same thing.

For some thirty years the author has been helping corporations and local government agencies cope with California’s regulatory jungle. As he puts it, “Crazifornia reveals a state that has become so misdirected, ungovernable and untenable that the primary driver of change has become the catastrophe.” Following the recent elections a recent Wall Street Journal editorial opined, “So now Californians will experience the joys of one-party, union-run progressive governance.”

Though it may defy belief, Californians voted to let the state tax them more to 13.3% and they gave Democrats a supermajority in both houses while killing a ballot initiative that would have barred unions from automatically withholding money from worker paychecks for political spending. The public service and other unions own California. Add that to a history of progressive politics and you have a recipe for the total disaster that confronts the state and the nation these days.
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Interesting article, more at the link.
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Author: 2828 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655794 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 8:51 AM
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What do the Californians get for their taxes? Not much. It ranks 48th among the states in elementary school rankings in reading and 49th in science. Not much value for the high rate of per-pupil spending. Its teachers are the highest paid in the nation.

California’s public workers are the second highest paid in the nation. The unfunded liability of their pensions and health-care benefits is estimated by Stanford University to be $500 billion—a half trillion dollars. If you love bloated bureaucracy, you will love California.

California’s obsession with spending on every liberal program proposed is such that, by 2009, the government was so much in debt it began to issue IOUs instead of wages. Its unemployment rate had risen to more than 12%, the highest figure in 70 years. Currently, the state has $73 billion in outstanding bonds for capital projects and $33 billion in voter-authorized bonds that the state hasn’t sold because it cannot afford higher debt payments.

The result of this fiscal insanity is that “In 2010, at least 204 companies said goodbye to the state, exactly four times more than fled in 2009. The exodus surged to more than 280 companies in 2011, when they left the state at a clip of 5.4 companies per week.” This just leaves joblessness and economic stagnation in its wake.
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Holy crap!

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Author: tjscott0 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655798 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 9:41 AM
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As California goes, so does our nation. Americans have become reliant on gov't doing fer them. Politicians has noted the change from rugged individualism & vote for entitlements. The GOP has become the democrat lite party. A vote for either party now is a surrender to commercial and political entities more than happy to act as parents for a self-infantilizing citizenry.

OK. Off my soap box & back underneath my rock.

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Author: 2828 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655799 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 10:16 AM
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As California goes, so does our nation. Americans have become reliant on gov't doing fer them. Politicians has noted the change from rugged individualism & vote for entitlements. The GOP has become the democrat lite party.
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"You just gotta live in this world kiddo".

What can you do? I consider republicans democrat very lite at this point at the rate the dems are going. Voting 3rd party and getting even more dems elected doesn't seem like a plan to me. I guess the question has to be if you let dems Cloward & Piven the economy will strict constitutionalism follow? Cloward & Piven didn't think so. I have no idea, but since i have discovered Facebook i have even less faith in the citizenry being able to draw a line from dem policies to the inevitable collapse, as a matter of fact i have little doubt that in 4 more years dems will still be blaming Bush and a very high percentage of people agreeing.

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Author: lowstudent Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655800 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 10:23 AM
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What can you do? I consider republicans democrat very lite at this point at the rate the dems are going. Voting 3rd party and getting even more dems elected doesn't seem like a plan to me. I guess the question has to be if you let dems Cloward & Piven the economy will strict constitutionalism follow? Cloward & Piven didn't think so. I have no idea, but since i have discovered Facebook i have even less faith in the citizenry being able to draw a line from dem policies to the inevitable collapse, as a matter of fact i have little doubt that in 4 more years dems will still be blaming Bush and a very high percentage of people agreeing.
_____________________

Doesn't a sane plan seem like voting Republican and forcing the Dems a little to the middle

Which forces the Republicans(or perhaps ALLOWS) to move a little more conservative

Then have that rinse and repeat for a few cycles

Do you really think Ron Paul is going to win an election if Mitt Romney can be painted as an extremist?

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Author: 2828 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655802 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 10:33 AM
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Do you really think Ron Paul is going to win an election if Mitt Romney can be painted as an extremist?
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They made McCain an extremist, when a few months earlier they were lauding him as one of a few sane republicans part of that gang of six or whatever number it was. Within months of celebrating him they had him on the Cover of Vanity Fair with fangs and blood dripping from his mouth.....classy.

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Author: MadCapitalist Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655803 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 10:48 AM
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Which forces the Republicans(or perhaps ALLOWS) to move a little more conservative

Republicans are idiots. If they want to turn things around, they need to:

1) Start making a compelling case that tax cuts and deregulation has not been the cause of our economic problems. They didn't do this at all, which I find amazing. They did absolutely nothing to show how absurd it was for Obama to claim that these were “the failed policies that got us into this mess.”

2) Lighten up on the anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage rhetoric. They may have strong feelings about it, but citizens are *deeply* divided on these issues. If anything, they should make it clear that they will leave it to the states to decide.

3) Dial down the crazy on things like rejecting science (the "legitimate rape" fiasco, for example) or suggesting that if rape victims get pregnant, it's because it was what God intended (Mourdock). Many Republicans are living in the Middle Ages, and it is definitely hurting the Republican Party.

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Author: warrl Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655804 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 11:22 AM
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The GOP has become the democrat lite party.

Historically, you got it backward: beginning the day after the Presidential election in 1932, the Democrat Party has become the GOP-only-more-so party.

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Author: lowstudent Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655806 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 11:27 AM
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<ik>Republicans are idiots. If they want to turn things around, they need to:

1) Start making a compelling case that tax cuts and deregulation has not been the cause of our economic problems. They didn't do this at all, which I find amazing. They did absolutely nothing to show how absurd it was for Obama to claim that these were “the failed policies that got us into this mess.”
____________________

Ryan and Romney did make this case, they did not however attack the Democaratic side. They did however make the case for what you wanted.

2) Lighten up on the anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage rhetoric. They may have strong feelings about it, but citizens are *deeply* divided on these issues. If anything, they should make it clear that they will leave it to the states to decide.

Why in a nation that is about evenly split it, is this a problem for one side and not the other? That is where I see the problem.
One side is extremist and the other side? If someone made an issue that Obama wants babies to be able to be killed, yes right until they are out of the body - death.
Both side have an equal number of extreme positions, Yet Republicans are expected to be perfect and it is OK for Democrats to suck big time

Don't get me wrong, I would prefer Republicans to be perfect. They are not they will have some stuff that is not 100 percent for all, so do the Democrats yet what do you hear?

3) Dial down the crazy on things like rejecting science (the "legitimate rape" fiasco, for example) or suggesting that if rape victims get pregnant, it's because it was what God intended (Mourdock). Many Republicans are living in the Middle Ages, and it is definitely hurting the Republican Party.

See above. The President of the United States of AMerica has stated he believes in abortion until the baby is completely out of the mother. There is not a more extreme position and nothing some nutjob can say anywhere is more screwed up, and I lean toward being pro-abortion

Have you heard some of the nuts that are Democrats? Al Gore and the environment is a whacked out as these loser Republicans.
Again, one side has to be perfect, the other side can suck unimaginably and they are the good guys.

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655807 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 11:39 AM
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MadCapitalist wrote: Lighten up on the anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage rhetoric. They may have strong feelings about it, but citizens are *deeply* divided on these issues. If anything, they should make it clear that they will leave it to the states to decide.

Yeah, what the hell, only 54 million baby human beings aborted and counting since Roe v Wade. Let the blood bath continue without so much as a whimper from anyone. Good job.

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Author: MadCapitalist Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655812 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 12:21 PM
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Republicans are idiots. If they want to turn things around, they need to:

1) Start making a compelling case that tax cuts and deregulation has not been the cause of our economic problems. They didn't do this at all, which I find amazing. They did absolutely nothing to show how absurd it was for Obama to claim that these were “the failed policies that got us into this mess.”

____________________

Ryan and Romney did make this case, they did not however attack the Democaratic side. They did however make the case for what you wanted.


No, they *didn't*. They didn't make the case that tax cuts couldn't have possibly led to a housing bubble that collapsed and caused a financial and economic crisis. They didn't make the case that regulation has been increasing and that *regulation*, not deregulation, was a major contributor to the financial crisis.

2) Lighten up on the anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage rhetoric. They may have strong feelings about it, but citizens are *deeply* divided on these issues. If anything, they should make it clear that they will leave it to the states to decide.

Why in a nation that is about evenly split it, is this a problem for one side and not the other?


It is *not* evenly split. I said it was deeply divided. A majority believes that abortion should be legal under any circumstances, and another quarter of the country believes that it should be legal under certain circumstances:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

There has also been a *huge* shift towards believing gay marriage should be allowed over the last two decades(scroll down to find the same-sex marriage poll):

http://www.gallup.com/poll/117328/marriage.aspx

3) Dial down the crazy on things like rejecting science (the "legitimate rape" fiasco, for example) or suggesting that if rape victims get pregnant, it's because it was what God intended (Mourdock). Many Republicans are living in the Middle Ages, and it is definitely hurting the Republican Party.

See above. The President of the United States of AMerica has stated he believes in abortion until the baby is completely out of the mother. There is not a more extreme position and nothing some nutjob can say anywhere is more screwed up, and I lean toward being pro-abortion

Have you heard some of the nuts that are Democrats? Al Gore and the environment is a whacked out as these loser Republicans.
Again, one side has to be perfect, the other side can suck unimaginably and they are the good guys.


Being in favor of legalizing abortion until birth has nothing to do with ridiculous views of science. And the AGW issue is not clearly wrong like the stupid "legitimate rape" comment.

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655814 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 12:39 PM
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MadCapitalist wrote: The President of the United States of America has stated he believes in abortion until the baby is completely out of the mother.

Owebama audibly sputtered as he argued there's no need for a law that mandates medical care for newborns who survived failed late-term abortions because he trusts abortion practitioners to provide medical care for the baby they unsuccessfully tried to kill in an abortion.

New Audio Surfaces of Obama Defending Infanticide in Illinois
http://www.lifenews.com/2012/08/23/new-audio-surfaces-of-oba...

Owebama is certifiably evil, in my opinion.

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Author: lowstudent Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655816 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:01 PM
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It is *not* evenly split. I said it was deeply divided. A majority believes that abortion should be legal under any circumstances, and another quarter of the country believes that it should be legal under certain circumstances:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

There has also been a *huge* shift towards believing gay marriage should be allowed over the last two decades(scroll down to find the same-sex marriage poll):

___________________

Oh please

52/48 we are talking a few nuts that believe rape is not a valid cause and Romney/Ryan was not among them

Romney Ryan did make the case that tax cuts etc was the road to success and that the other was a road to failure. They simply did. That you did not hear it, and that lots of folks did not hear it is another matter. The Republican message on LOTS of stuff is not heard


It is *not* evenly split. I said it was deeply divided. A majority believes that abortion should be legal under any circumstances, and another quarter of the country believes that it should be legal under certain circumstances:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

There has also been a *huge* shift towards believing gay marriage should be allowed over the last two decades(scroll down to find the same-sex marriage poll):


That is utterly absurd, this is a belief that life does not begin until after it emerges from the birth canal -- that is totally against science and is absurd.

I also mentioned Al Gore and the allegiance to man made warming which flies in the face of decent science since it must ignore exist evidence to be forwarded.

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Author: fleg9bo Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655818 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:01 PM
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Yeah, what the hell, only 54 million baby human beings aborted and counting since Roe v Wade. Let the blood bath continue without so much as a whimper from anyone. Good job.

That kind of talk is what got Barbara Boxer elected senator from your state.

--fleg

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Author: MadCapitalist Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655819 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:05 PM
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MadCapitalist wrote: The President of the United States of America has stated he believes in abortion until the baby is completely out of the mother.

I didn't write this.

By the way, I don't read your posts, although I see that you reply to my posts quite often. I just happened to see the misquote above when I clicked on the "Replies to Your Posts" link.

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Author: MadCapitalist Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655820 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:08 PM
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That is utterly absurd, this is a belief that life does not begin until after it emerges from the birth canal -- that is totally against science and is absurd.

Who argues that? Do you have any quotes?

Personally, I'm pro-choice, and I don't believe that.

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655821 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:08 PM
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If I was running for office in CA (or anywhere, for that matter), I would say (over and over, if necessary), "I believe abortion is wrong. I oppose it, always have and always will; however, I will take no action to overturn Roe v Wade. But make no mistake, just because there's a law allowing abortion doesn't make it right. I'm not going to get into justifications for abortion but will state whenever I'm asked that I believe abortion is wrong."

What else can one do? But to say nothing about the obliteration of 54 million baby human beings is just as wrong.

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655824 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:09 PM
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MadCapitalist wrote: MadCapitalist wrote: The President of the United States of America has stated he believes in abortion until the baby is completely out of the mother. I didn't write this. By the way, I don't read your posts, although I see that you reply to my posts quite often. I just happened to see the misquote above when I clicked on the "Replies to Your Posts" link.

Oh, I am SOOOOOO sorry, MadCapitalist. So as not to misquote you in the future, I'll return the favor and PLOINK! there you go.

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Author: telegraph Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655826 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 1:15 PM
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the country is going down the financial drain...

and yet the topic of discussion is abortion...

and the libya cover up....

---

I hope at least some of the politicians are sweating their butts off working out some tax reform and entitlement reform......


meanwhile....

most Americans are probably getting set to watch football and could care less about Libya...the cover up...other than the sex scandal, the ladies involved, ...and their sex lives and who they 'did'.....soap opera stuff......

Meanwhile, the middle east is about to explode....the Arab Spring is turning into Arab Nightmare approaching midnight on the Titanic.....


t.

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Author: tjscott0 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655833 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 2:49 PM
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The Ryan plan is a weak knee proposal that won't lead to solvecy until 2040. And that 2040 number is based on current defense spending that Romney would have violated & consistently above-average economic growth is an unrealistic dodge to avoid hard policy choices.

The sad truth is that our real GDP growth has been declining since the 1960's.

http://www.crestmontresearch.com/docs/Economy-GDP-Productivi...

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Author: 2828 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655834 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 2:51 PM
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The Ryan plan is a weak knee proposal that won't lead to solvecy until 2040. And that 2040 number is based on current defense spending that Romney would have violated & consistently above-average economic growth is an unrealistic dodge to avoid hard policy choices.
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Agreed....and dems called it "extreme", on the other hand the CBO couldn't score Obama's plan because no civilization has ever survived that much debt. You have 2 choices.

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Author: tjscott0 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655838 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 3:15 PM
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Agreed....and dems called it "extreme", on the other hand the CBO couldn't score Obama's plan because no civilization has ever survived that much debt. You have 2 choices.

I really don't think there is a solution as both parties are spenders. Some day it will come to a squeaking halt when foreign countries stop buying our debt.

I'm resigned to the fact that the GOP has sold out & it ain't gonna change. So elections no longer interest me much as I vote libertarian as a protest vote. I concentrate on my LYBM lifestyle--something I have some control over.

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Author: lowstudent Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655844 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 4:24 PM
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The Ryan plan is a weak knee proposal that won't lead to solvecy until 2040. And that 2040 number is based on current defense spending that Romney would have violated & consistently above-average economic growth is an unrealistic dodge to avoid hard policy choices.
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Agreed....and dems called it "extreme", on the other hand the CBO couldn't score Obama's plan because no civilization has ever survived that much debt. You have 2 choices.
______________________________________

I think we all agree Ryan's plan should be more aggressive

The problem is none of us is in Congress, or left to our own perfect candidate would create someone who would get elected mayor even of a reasonably conservative medium sized city

Ryan's plan was as ferocious as anything with any chance of getting passed

You do not turn an ocean liner on a dime. Do something sane, see slightly sane results and you can do something more.

Now we are just further away, and at best something as 'severe' may be put in place and get us out of our problems in 2044

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Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 5:59 PM
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lowstudent wrote: You do not turn an ocean liner on a dime. Do something sane, see slightly sane results and you can do something more.

That's right. When a country tries this--with so called "austerity" programs--you get rioting in the streets ala Greece.

The first thing Congress should do is take the fraud out of the entitlement programs already in place. This would take a few years but would prove to all Americans of both political stripes that Congress is serious about the deficit.

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Author: ascenzm Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655893 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 10:12 PM
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Some day it will come to a squeaking halt when foreign countries stop buying our debt.

I'm resigned to the fact that the GOP has sold out & it ain't gonna change. So elections no longer interest me much as I vote libertarian as a protest vote. I concentrate on my LYBM lifestyle--something I have some control over.

tjscott0


You always hear, "You must vote. Every vote counts." Sadly I no longer think that is true. I don't trust our electoral process and even if the process was fraud proofed, I have a very low opinion of the American electorate (free stuff will always win).

The wheels are going to come off before anything gets done to try and fix our economic mess. It will be too late then.

As far as LYBM goes, don't deny yourself things that you will enjoy. It could be quite possible in the near future that you may no longer be able to acquire things that bring you enjoyment.

Mike

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655902 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/18/2012 11:52 PM
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ascenzm wrote: The wheels are going to come off before anything gets done to try and fix our economic mess. It will be too late then.

What do you think our country will look like when the wheels come off? I'm picturing Greece or London, with rioting in the streets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=661pi6K-8WQ

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Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/19/2012 7:25 AM
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What do you think our country will look like when the wheels come off? I'm picturing Greece or London, with rioting in the streets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=661pi6K-8WQ

CC


IMHO, when the EBT cards start getting rejected in grocery stores, there will be "disturbances" that will dwarf the LA riots. An urban area will not be a desireable place to be at that time.

Mike

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Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/19/2012 8:34 AM
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IMHO, when the EBT cards start getting rejected in grocery stores, there will be "disturbances" that will dwarf the LA riots. An urban area will not be a desireable place to be at that time.

Mike
____________________________

Things could get incredibly ugly incredibly fast

I do not expect them to, but we have millions and millions of people dependent on food being brought to them daily. We start big riots, people start suffering FAST.

Americans are moving toward stupid, stupidity always has a price.

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Author: CCinOC Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 655944 of 744148
Subject: Re: Crazifornia Date: 11/19/2012 10:40 AM
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ascenzm wrote: IMHO, when the EBT cards start getting rejected in grocery stores, there will be "disturbances" that will dwarf the LA riots.

This situation already occurred and this is what it looks like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dinIGlzlwY

Star Parker, author, "Uncle Sam's Plantation"

"Welfare Dependency Destroys Black Families"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqtE-f0yZoA

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