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Author: earthsphere One star, 50 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 3431  
Subject: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/23/2007 7:36 PM
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I will not buy any stocks of Chinese companies, period! Remember China is still a Communist country. That is why I don't trust their government. I will buy only when China is no more Communist country. I hope our people do not forget that the China is still Communist. Wow! It seems that money is more improtant than what kind of government.
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Author: BMW2001 Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3121 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/24/2007 12:49 PM
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"May a Thousand Flowers Bloom."

Chmn Mao






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Author: CalimanChi Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3122 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/24/2007 8:04 PM
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Earthsphere,

I respect your strong feelings toward your beliefs. I would caution you, though, on claiming China is a communist country. I say this, not to discount that The People's Republic of China was founded by the winner's of the Chinese Civil War, who were declared Communists, but rather to point out what China is today.

China qualifies as a dictatorship, I will give you that. There are different political choices than we have in the U.S., and much censorship in the press (although that is becoming more free over time.)

What it is not, is Communist. China today is very similar economically to the United States of the 1880's-1920's, with Chinese characteristics. Its economic system is an amalgamation of the hardest, strongest, and most severe form of Capitalism with a declining state sector that, although still large, is not the driving force behind economic growth. The China with whom most are doing business is not the China of Chairman Mao, but that of Deng Xiaoping, whose famous words about his preferred economic system were: Who cares if the cat is black or white, as long as it catches mice. What he was saying is, it does not matter if we are capitalist or communist as long as we have economic prosperity.

The Chinese industrialist and business leaders of today are not communists. They chase the all mighty Dollar/Yuan as much as their brothers in the OECD countries. They are hard corp capitalists that would give J.P. Morgan, Andrew Carnegie, and Henry Ford a run for their money.

You may not agree with the political system that China has, but their economic system is anything but Communist, and has been increasingly less so since 1979.

I invite you to talk with me more about this topic if you are interested. I am a former intelligence analyst on China and feel that it is horribly misunderstood by most Americans. I also have no illusions that it is any better than it is. The country has tremendous political, social, economic and other problems that could dissuade investment based on fundamental analysis. The key thing to remember is that analysis is required, not jingoism.

Regards,

Jeremy



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Author: haywool Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3123 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/24/2007 10:12 PM
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Jeremy ...

Thank you for clairfying the difference between political China and economic China. You are, indeed, qualified to enlighten us.

We must remember that just because it was ... does not mean that it still is.

The capitalistic economy in China is to be thought of similar to the capitalistic economy in U.S.A. at the dawn of the 20th century (1900). There is money to be made for those Foolish (capital F) but not foolish (small f).

Thanx,
Rich (haywool)

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Author: CalimanChi Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3124 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/25/2007 4:02 AM
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Exactly! Thanks Rich



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Author: BMW2001 Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3125 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 5/25/2007 12:56 PM
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Do you really trust China? I truly hope so. The balance of payments to their side is very skewed toward the Sino side of the Sino-American trade exchange.

Referring to China as a Communist or even a communist regime is comparing Germany to its former Nazi govt. There remains vestiges in both countries, I suppose. Dictatorships of all kinds, abound as well. Many are not Communists, some are Islamic. Do you trust them? We do need their oil.

My son who is majoring in marketing in a post graduate program is also taking intensive courses in Mandarin. We need to make extreme efforts to understand the Chinese, better. We are not going to make them into our version of capitalism. They have their own distinct culture.

Trust begins with understanding. If we do not understand our Chinese business partners, their culture, their protocol, then how can you trust them with anything?

It is my belief that the post that started this discussion was based upon the dated, cold war polemics that dominated the latter half of the Twentieth Century.

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Author: kahunacfa Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3134 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 7/5/2007 7:22 PM
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China's businesses have different quality control and environmental standards (virtually none - think the United States in the early eighteen hundreds). The results have been contaminated, poisoned dog food, unsafe children's toys, toxic materials in consumer products - Buyer, and user beware!!!!

Kahuna,CFA

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Author: garysp7 Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 3136 of 3431
Subject: Re: Do you really trust China? Date: 7/6/2007 11:24 PM
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I don't trust anyone Kahuna. I tend to believe what I see and not what I am told.
I do believe this though. It is unreastic to think as a consumer that I would not buy any of my products that are made in China. Almost everything is and that only considering what is actually labeled as being made there. What about the products that we make there and then ship and assemble here so we can then put our made in America tag on it?
Lets say we do start making everything here instead of China,
the product would most likely be four times the cost to the consumer due to the companies health care costs, retirement plan costs and salaries. Who wants that as a business owner!
I think overall as consumers and business owners we are better off farming out our manufacturing even though the quality control isuues then becomes more difficult in some instances. In many cases, the overall quality is much better for less cost.
Most likely the answer is to have a US presence in China at ones own factory to ensure that the quality is not compromised.
Gary


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