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Author: lifeforcedanceri Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 46847  
Subject: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 12:23 PM
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It is ludicrous to assume that a part time investor can beat a 24/7 professional over time.

Personal investments are best left to mutual funds, real estate, and your own professional manager whose primary qualification is that you and friends found him/her trustworthy.
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Author: brewer12345 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32871 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 12:28 PM
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I guess this is meant to be a troll, right?

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Author: DCFNewbie Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32874 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 12:58 PM
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I guess this is meant to be a troll, right?

Mmmmm, a very weak effort. I would give him a 4 out of 10 at the most.

6 on technical merit (it's short and to the point), but only 2 on content (that mutual fund reference really brought his score down).


DCFNewbie



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Author: brewer12345 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32876 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 2:46 PM
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I dunno. Tossing in that trendy real estate thing really adds something, IMO. Maybe another .5.

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Author: lifeforcedanceri Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32878 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 3:27 PM
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Seriously, buy and hold is true if you hold over twenty years, but how many people can do that? You need a manager to buy and sell without unnecessarily churning. That leaves reputable mutual fund managers like at Vanguard or your own honest personal manager find.

Real estate is good simply because people tend to hold on to it long term.

I used to be a poster at the Gorilla Game, but the bursting of the bubble proved that was nonsense.

Some of us can fix sinks, but many are ahead to hire a plumber before they make the problem worse.

Back to business, what mutual funds do people here like? VPMCX and VGHCX have been successful in the past. VSEQX, VIMSX and VIPSX look interesting.

I realize you have to hold mutual funds five years at least to make real money, but they are on auto pilot after that if you selected wisely.

Which funds do you think are worth considering?

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Author: hildy Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32879 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 4:04 PM
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Which funds do you think are worth considering?



Hi Life...

I have been watching some of the Vanguard Index Funds and have kept a small spreadsheet for my own interest and comparison.

The following is from that spreadsheet.

CURNPV BEGNPV PRCHG %CHG CAGR
----------------------------------------------
08/27/04 10/12/01
----------------------------------------------
NAESX $22.95 $17.45 $5.50 31.52% 10.00%
VISGX $12.69 $9.54 $3.15 33.02% 11.49%
VISVX $12.17 $8.98 $3.19 35.52% 12.36%



NAESX Small-Cap Index Fund
VISGX Small-Cap Growth Index Fund
VISVX Small-Cap Value Index Fund

I took a position in VISGX on 11/01/01, just shortly after I started looking at the following, beginning on 10/12/01:

NAESX Small-Cap Index Fund
VEXMX Extended Market Index Fund
VFINX 500 Index Fund
VIGRX Growth Index Fund
VIMSX Mid-Cap Index Fund
VISGX Small-Cap Growth Index Fund
VISVX Small-Cap Value Index Fund
VIVAX Value Index Fund
VTSMX Total Stock Market Index Fund

I have been doing pretty good with VISGX but beginning at June 1, 2004 it looks like VISVX is now beating my pick, and I think it has been due to the major decline over the last 6 to 8 weeks.


Cheers;

~hildy

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Author: GrandpaRalph Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32880 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 4:04 PM
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Hi lifeforcedanceri,

We are, for the most part, a group of stock pickers here. There are exceptions of course, but "stock research" and "research methodology" are generally what we discuss. Some of us are very good. Some of us are trying to learn to be better, and the good ones here are glad to try and help those that are trying to learn to be better. Some of us have decided, after giving stock picking a fair try, that mutual funds or index funds suit their investment style better. That's perfectly acceptable and we wish them well. But they don't generally continue to hang out here, except to maintain cyber-friendships, which we welcome. They generally find more discussions of interest at the Mutual Fund Board or Index Fund Board:

http://boards.fool.com/Messages.asp?bid=100101
http://boards.fool.com/Messages.asp?bid=100111

Did I mention I'd like to help you out?

So, which way did you come in?

Ralph



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Author: dlbuffy Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32882 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 4:11 PM
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It is ludicrous to assume that a part time investor can beat a 24/7 professional over time.

Based on what evidence?
I can fix my car and plumb my house better than half of the 24/7 professionals that I have seen. And I teach computers for a living.

Buffy (who wonders if the trolls are hungry...)

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Author: DCFNewbie Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32884 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 4:13 PM
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Seriously, buy and hold is true if you hold over twenty years, but how many people can do that? You need a manager to buy and sell without unnecessarily churning. That leaves reputable mutual fund managers like at Vanguard or your own honest personal manager find.

The secret for good trolling is about being selective regarding facts.

I used to be a poster at the Gorilla Game, but the bursting of the bubble proved that was nonsense.

This is a fact. A proved fact. By inserting it into the text it contributes to the validation of the entire post.

That leaves reputable mutual fund managers like at Vanguard or your own honest personal manager find.

Did you see that? He mentioned Vanguard. By doing so he is leveraging credibility.

Furthermore, he ends with a question.

Which funds do you think are worth considering?

By doing that he eludes the masses by masquerading trolling with genuine doubt.That's an extra special credit!

The fact that there is effort in rebutting initial accusations of trolling is also very cutting hedge.

----------------------
Technical merit: 6
Artistic Merit: 7
Tilt: 8
----------------------
Trolling meter score: 7


Best regards,

DCFNewbie

P.S. Don't take offense, I'm only joking.

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Author: dlbuffy Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32885 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 4:15 PM
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Dang! Late to the party, ya'll already covered troll and Life covered plumbing. Well at least I got the car part.

But, I wonder what the theory of holding real estate for a long time does to all those people (that I know) that make money fixing/flipping?

Buffy (who should know better than to out creative this group, nice post Grandpa...)

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Author: lifeforcedanceri Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32891 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/30/2004 11:09 PM
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This board is serious BS. I am going to the mutual fund board.

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Author: 1971simon Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32897 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/31/2004 1:25 PM
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This board is serious BS. I am going to the mutual fund board.

What did he expect here? Especially after Grandpa's very polite but pointed post.

Did he even figure out where he was before he posted? That would be like me showing up at the BRK board and declaring myself a day-trader and expecting people to applaud me.

Better yet, we could all go over the to Mutual Funds boards and espouse individual stock research and then complain when we didn't get support from the regulars there.

Man, some people are bizzare....

Simon

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Author: hondodog Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32898 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/31/2004 1:41 PM
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Seriously, buy and hold is true if you hold over twenty years, but how many people can do that? You need a manager to buy and sell without unnecessarily churning. That leaves reputable mutual fund managers like at Vanguard or your own honest personal manager find.

this conflicts with my personal experience of brokers...my "broker" expert was fairly consistent in trying to move my accounts in and out of "opportunities"....

in comparing my own trading activity, i find that my turnover rate is less than 10%, which seems much smaller than the mutual funds i have investigated...churning is surely an act of choice, or inclination....

all of us must find the investment style that suits our own personalities and comfort level....

good luck to us all in our own special ways...

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Author: dlbuffy Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 32899 of 46847
Subject: Re: Hire a professional Date: 8/31/2004 2:15 PM
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..... in our own special ways...

<grin>

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