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Author: robinson0551 Three stars, 500 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 196899  
Subject: Re: Question for any Calvinists who are Still He Date: 10/3/2001 2:33 PM
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I said: ...but there are also many atheists who believe that the universe had a beginning and will have an end. A creator or god is not necessary for this to be true and is, in fact, quite unlikely.

then Bryan asked: Could you substantiate this statement? Thanks.

I can try. First I'll remind you that this isn't currently the way I'm leaning as far as the whole origins of the universe thing goes.

I don't think a creator is necessary for the universe to end. If the universe suddenly and fatally imploded completely tomorrow for some reason, there is no reason a creator had to be around to cause it. That, of course, is only half of it. As far as the beginning goes, that's the interesting part.

If there actually was a beginning, then the universe just suddenly started existing without cause because, by definition, there was nothing around to cause it. Adding a creator to the beginning of the story doesn't solve anything, because then it wasn't really the beginning. Where did the creator come from? What caused it?

Anyway, I'm sure there are a million different "explanations" as to what could have started it all, but the explanation of some guy in the sky (even before there actually was a sky) creating it all and then caring a lot about everyone simultaneously but not enough to prevent bad things from happening to them is certainly only one of them. And that one explanation has no more proof than any of the others (and less in some cases). In my mind, that makes it unlikely at best.

That's where the statement you're asking about came from.

Robinson
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