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Author: TMFPMarti Big funky green star, 20000 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 63022  
Subject: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 5:29 PM
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This issue was touched on in the Immigration thread. Although liberal Sen. Barbara Boxer was mentioned, the privacy lobby isn't restricted to any particular part of the political spectrum.

Political conversation seems to dance around the issue, for example, in the kerfuffle over driver's licenses and illegal aliens, but never addresses it head on. I'd be interested in Foolish thoughts on the question of whether we should have some sort of nationwide ID card that says the bearer is here legally. For my taste I'm more interested in thoughts about the concept rather than the execution, accepting that any system has its problems with forgeries, lost/stolen cards, etc.

Maybe I've seen too many WW II and cold war movies ("Give me your papers"), but the idea kinda gives me the creeps.

Phil
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Author: ChiliChild Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11518 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 5:32 PM
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Maybe I've seen too many WW II and cold war movies ("Give me your papers"), but the idea kinda gives me the creeps.

Phil


I'm with you, Phil.

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Author: Jeanwa Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11526 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 10:35 PM
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I'd be interested in Foolish thoughts on the question of whether we should have some sort of nationwide ID card that says the bearer is here legally. For my taste I'm more interested in thoughts about the concept rather than the execution, accepting that any system has its problems with forgeries, lost/stolen cards, etc.

Maybe I've seen too many WW II and cold war movies ("Give me your papers"), but the idea kinda gives me the creeps.


I guess it used to give me the creeps too....maybe I watched the same movies. That said, what information could be obtained with a National ID card than isn't already available now, if you get a driver's license?

Not too off topic I hope...I was talking to a friend this morning that works with foster kids. They have been trying for almost a year to get an ID card for a kid that moved to Washington State from New York. His dad is in prison and his mother has a restraining order against her. His "guardian is "the state". There is no specific guardian. The even had a judge give a statement with the kids picture for verification.

(he's 17 and wants a job, which he can't get in WA without completing an I9)

The Department of Licensing also issues the ID cards. They (the DSHS people, the foster care people, and the kids attorney) have gone to the DOL in three different counties. Because of they types of things they require for verification he can't get an ID.

http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/idproof.html

He didn't have any of the primary documents and they said he needed 5 of the alternate documents. After reading them this morning, we did decide that he had one supporting document, the verification letter, so only needed 2 of the others.

So given the I9 requirement, and the driver's license, and Social Security card; don't we already have a national ID, we just don't have a card?

Jean

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Author: salaryguru Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11528 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 10:40 PM
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I think that all Bush neo-cons should be required to have a National Bubba ID . . . and they should be required to wear it in a prominent place at all times. FOXnews should be required to pay all expenses related to printing and distributing the ID cards.

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Author: crassfool Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11531 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 11:17 PM
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TMFPMarti says

Maybe I've seen too many WW II and cold war movies ("Give me your papers"), but the idea kinda gives me the creeps.


Waaaaaay back in the late 50's, I was driving through North Beach in San Francisco with a buddy, when we ran into a police roadblock. We got pulled over. Nothing happened for a few minutes, while we sat in fear, because the SFPD had a reputation as a bunch of Fascists. And we were a couple of beardy beatniks.

Eventually a cop came up to my window and said, in a very noticeable German accent, "I was in Germany during the war. I don't like this any more than you do. Now get out of here."

We got out of there. Yeah, it's a totally creepy idea.

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Author: telegraph Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11534 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/17/2008 11:51 PM
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"Eventually a cop came up to my window and said, in a very noticeable German accent, "I was in Germany during the war. I don't like this any more than you do. Now get out of here."

They were probably looking for a couple surfer dudes who just held up a bank...obviously you didn't fit the description but they had to check out every car and the back seats to be sure the bad guys didn't get away.

You already have a drivers license. You get stopped, they run it to be sure it is valid and matches your car. Otherwise, you got explaining to do if your car is registered to someone else 500 miles away. Soon they'll be able to pull up a pic on the license too, to make sure the pic hasn't been altered....

t.

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Author: TMFPMarti Big funky green star, 20000 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11536 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/18/2008 12:09 AM
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So given the I9 requirement, and the driver's license, and Social Security card; don't we already have a national ID, we just don't have a card?

The I9 is required only when you start work, so that doesn't apply to everyone. Driver's licenses don't apply to people who don't drive. Social Security cards are not identification. What's missing from all except the I9 process and driver's licenses in those states where the legislature has decided it's preferable to have unlicensed drivers rather than licensed illegal aliens driving is the "It's legal for me to be here" aspect.

Part of why I raise the issue is recent developments in Prince William County, Virginia, where they are considering (or passed) a law instructing county law enforcement to detain people "suspected" of being in the country illegally. Does this mean I should start carrying my passport when transiting that county just in case I peeve the wrong cop? (Yes, everyone knows they're targeting Hispanics, but they can't actually put that in the law, so it applies to everyone.)

Phil

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Author: Jeanwa Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 11541 of 63022
Subject: Re: Identity Cards Date: 2/18/2008 10:03 AM
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Part of why I raise the issue is recent developments in Prince William County, Virginia, where they are considering (or passed) a law instructing county law enforcement to detain people "suspected" of being in the country illegally. Does this mean I should start carrying my passport when transiting that county just in case I peeve the wrong cop? (Yes, everyone knows they're targeting Hispanics, but they can't actually put that in the law, so it applies to everyone.)

If you don't have a driver's license or other form of ID, I'd say yes, you should carry your passport.

That said, I can think of only a very few adults in WA that wouldn't have an ID or driver's license here. You have to have it to work, to buy booze or cigs.

If they are detaining pepole "suspected" of being here illegally, I would think they would detain them until they found out if the ID,etc was valid. So even with a passport you could be detained until the could prove that was actually your valid passport. With alll the red tape that could take weeks.

Jean...watches too much tv.

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