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Author: BenGrahamMan Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 156927  
Subject: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/11/2012 1:07 PM
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I was really surprised to see these stats.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/86/Usage_sha...

http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp
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Author: ragrant Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155867 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/11/2012 1:58 PM
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The following is what I would have expected, but it was interesting to see it on W3Schools site:
W3Schools is a website for people with an interest for web technologies. These people are more interested in using alternative browsers than the average user. The average user tends to the browser that comes preinstalled with their computer, and do not seek out other browser alternatives.

These facts indicate that the browser figures above are not 100% realistic. Other web sites have statistics showing that Internet Explorer is a more popular browser.

Rich

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155868 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/11/2012 3:30 PM
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All the different sites have slightly different ways of measuring market share and they are all equally (in)valid in a way. If Chrome hasn't passed IE yet, the trend-lines suggest it will soon.

The specifics don't really matter though, IE's market share is on a major downward trend and has been for years.

Another sign of an Empire in decline.

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Author: HMALETTER Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155869 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/12/2012 5:47 AM
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The specifics don't really matter though, IE's market share is on a major downward trend and has been for years.

Another sign of an Empire in decline.
______________________

Not really, it's more a sign that there are better, much better, products out there.

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155870 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/12/2012 2:14 PM
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The way I see it Microsoft's inability to produce quality software is directly linked to their decline.

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Author: MarkP28665 Three stars, 500 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155871 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/12/2012 6:30 PM
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I have used a lot of MS software over the years and in my experience the MS products themselves are are much better quality than most vendor products we have purchased.

The browser numbers posted are highly questionable since Windows has 90% of the desktop market and IE comes with Windows. As the one reference stated most users do not change browsers and most businesses support IE hence simple logic says most users probably use IE.

-- Mark --

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Author: RHinCT Big red star, 1000 posts Ticker Guide SC1 Red Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155872 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/12/2012 8:08 PM
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...hence simple logic says most users probably use IE.

Logic is great, but it is illogical to depend on it when there are a variety of direct measurements available to validate (or contradict) what logic predicts. In the case of browser usage I think you will be hard put to find any hard indication that IE has even a 40% market share, much less a majority.

One example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_web_browsers#Sum...

RH in CT

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155873 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/12/2012 10:39 PM
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Even if you ignore the actual stats which have been gathered from multiple sources, over 35% of Windows computers are running Windows XP and you can't get a remotely modern version of IE working on Windows XP. The internet sucks on IE 8 so all those XP users have a huge incentive to install something else.

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Author: MarkP28665 Three stars, 500 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155874 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/13/2012 8:05 PM
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But all those sites are pretty much consumer only numbers. When you take a look at business usage the percentages change back into IE favor by a wide margin. IDC published a report with backup for how it was put together.

MS still appears to have about 50% of the consumer market and I suspect that it actually has more based on where the numbers come from.

Aa for running IE on XP the site where I works runs 8 on hundreds of computers without issue and hopefully by year-end will have everyone on Windows 7 and IE 9.

But since MS does not sell IE or make money from it the choice of browswer has little effect on MS's long-term prospects. The sales figures for Windows 8 on the other hand will be significant to the future bottom line.


-- Mark --

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155875 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/13/2012 9:12 PM
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I'd love to see a link to IDC's numbers and what methods they used to gather them since they apparently contradict nearly every other metric out there.

The numbers gathered are for total traffic, most web sites have no idea whether the end-point is a business user or a consumer. There are a lot of businesses that are slaved to IE in some way shape or form due to applications requirements (usually for internal apps), that doesn't mean people use IE to surf the web using IE.

Years ago Microsoft recognized the strategic importance of the internet, it's the entire reason Microsoft made such huge efforts to crush Netscape. It's also why they spent 6.2 Billion investing in aQuantive and have spent billions trying to build up Bing, MSNBC, and their other web properties.

The browser is an essential piece of the internet equation, companies use browsers to gather information about their users, Google uses it to steer people to their site, Firefox uses their browser to generate revenue. Whether you are concerned about browser market share or not, there are people in Redmond who are quite concerned with it.

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Author: dsbrady Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155876 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/14/2012 1:36 PM
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But since MS does not sell IE or make money from it the choice of browswer has little effect on MS's long-term prospects.

Good thing they spent all that money on IE then.

dsbrady

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Author: Goofyhoofy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155877 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/14/2012 2:31 PM
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Good thing they spent all that money on IE then

There was a point at which they feared the browser becoming an operating platform which could use any generic software a layer up. So Word, Excel, etc. wouldn't need to run on Windows, word processing or spreadsheet or whatever would run on a browser - and would be platform independent.

That would kill the "ecosystem" (to use a word in vogue today) that Microsoft built up between its OS and softwares, and make switching costs and friction fall to near zero.

They wanted control of the browser because it (potentially) shaped the direction of the entire industry. It didn't pan out that way, but it might have. Once they had hegemony and the network effect of proprietary formats, it became much harder to move in with a Google Docs or other freeware competitor.

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Author: 0gre Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155878 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/14/2012 4:22 PM
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So Word, Excel, etc. wouldn't need to run on Windows, word processing or spreadsheet or whatever would run on a browser - and would be platform independent.

Maybe this alternate product would be have tons of collaborative features and be given away for free. It would probably be called Something Docs.... like "Google Docs" for example...

They wanted control of the browser because it (potentially) shaped the direction of the entire industry.

It does control the shape of the industry. HTML 5 is pretty huge and there are lots of 'Apps' and web services which are essentially complex HTML+Javascript pages. The catch is that the standards finally did catch on and rather than lose out to Netscape, they lost out to standards compliant sites.

Sadly, Microsoft has been by far the slowest company to adopt standards and they've deliberately left 40% of their users out of the upgrade cycle.

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Author: Goofyhoofy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Top Favorite Fools Top Recommended Fools Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155879 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/14/2012 5:30 PM
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It does control the shape of the industry. HTML 5 is pretty huge and there are lots of 'Apps' and web services which are essentially complex HTML+Javascript pages. The catch is that the standards finally did catch on and rather than lose out to Netscape, they lost out to standards compliant sites.

Sadly, Microsoft has been by far the slowest company to adopt standards and they've deliberately left 40% of their users out of the upgrade cycle.


I think that's the point. They maneuvered themself into "the standard" instead of allowing someone else to do it. There is a reason they still have 90% (argue for other figures if you like, it's still huge) of the desktop OS, and it's not just because of the OS. It's because of the interlock between Word, Excel, and the OS, which begat an almost monopoly platform,c hich begat proprietary softwares for medicine, metallurgy and everything in between.

If all those other softwares were platform independent, the OS share would be plummeting much faster than it is.

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Author: TMFFrank One star, 50 posts Home Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 155889 of 156927
Subject: Re: Microsoft and browser market share Date: 9/23/2012 11:59 AM
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"I think that's the point. They maneuvered themself into "the standard" instead of allowing someone else to do it. There is a reason they still have 90% (argue for other figures if you like, it's still huge) of the desktop OS, and it's not just because of the OS. It's because of the interlock between Word, Excel, and the OS, which begat an almost monopoly platform,c hich begat proprietary softwares for medicine, metallurgy and everything in between."

What are you counting with that 90 percent number? New sales or installed base? I heard it was higher.

Data from the NPD group showed that while 10-14 percent of US households now have a Mac, only 2 percent are mac only. Considering that about 1 percent are linux only, this means that 97 percent of US households have some sort of Windows machine running at home. Though one could argue that new sales are more 'forward looking,' nobody can deny Microsoft still has a truly extraordinary amount of leverage. If they can get their act together and kick the hardware makers into line, they're well positioned to reverse these trends.

Anyway, I completely agree with everything else you said, just quibbling over that one number. The power of a windows/office system isn't the software itself, it's everything built on top of it. When you consider all the third party application (both free and proprietary) designed to use Office as a front end, Google is light years behind.

Linux and OSX have done more to catch Windows, but without Office, Mr. Softy still has the advantage here, too.

Thanks,
Frank

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