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Author: halco Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 63118  
Subject: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/21/2008 7:12 AM
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Let's piss some people off:

10 - West Side Story
9 - The Sound of Music
8 - The Lion King
7 - Easy Rider
6 - Rebel Without a Cause
5 - Forrest Gump
4 - The Sting
3 - Gone with the Wind
2 - The Shawshank Redemption
1 - The Searchers

Harold
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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51606 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/21/2008 8:26 AM
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Are you looking for "great" but "overrated," or "overrated" and not really "great"?

Ken

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Author: ibbieta Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51609 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/21/2008 1:40 PM
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10 - West Side Story
Agree. This is just a bad movie. So bad it's sometimes fun to watch but cringe-worthy bad at times.
9 - The Sound of Music
8 - The Lion King

Agree. But I also hate musicals so I'll agree to almost all of them being overrated. I do not think either is as horrible as West Side, however.
7 - Easy Rider
Tough call because this is not widely considered "great" and I do not think it received many awards. I have always thought of it as a cult classic which I think suits it just fine.
6 - Rebel Without a Cause
Dated, so very dated. Also, not an award winner nor much viewed.
5 - Forrest Gump
No argument from me with this one. Not a bad movie, just not a great one. Becoming dated very quickly.
4 - The Sting
Forgotten, almost. Was popular at the time and won awards, I believe, but no one watches it anymore. Fun little film, however.
3 - Gone with the Wind
Awful, awful movie. Just wretched, I agree.
2 - The Shawshank Redemption
Tough call. It gets lots of air time but in theatrical distribution it landed with a thud. I doubt many people consider it anything except "better than what else is on TV" which is damning with faint praise.
1 - The Searchers
Good movie but vastly overrated. Should be viewed more as a historical film, in the sense that movies changed after its release and the other film makers who cite this movie's influence on them.

I would add "Schindler's List" which was clichéd and laughably bad. "Pretty Woman" was, and is, way too popular for me to understand.

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Author: CrestlineKathy Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51610 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/21/2008 2:41 PM
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I agree with that list except for The Shawshank Redemption....awesome movie, one of my favorites, I can watch that one over and over.

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Author: halco Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51613 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 9:42 AM
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ib,

Your opinions definitely run contrary to the mainstream, however, since you mostly agree w/moi, I'm going to have say your taste is most discerning, indeed.

2 - The Shawshank Redemption
Tough call. It gets lots of air time but in theatrical distribution it landed with a thud. I doubt many people consider it anything except "better than what else is on TV" which is damning with faint praise.


TSR is #2 on IMDb's list of their 250 top-rated movies. Yes, number 2, I kid you not. I've written about it here before in-depth and my nasty analysis got about 6 recs, while the rebuttal, by Albaby (which was, admittedly, very well-written, though I completely disagreed w/it) got literally 10 times that amount and is one of the highest-rated posts in the history of this board. So obviously more than a few movie-lovers consider this to be a great movie.

"Easy Rider" is certainly considered a "cult classic" because it was the first mainstream movie about drugs and the counter-culture of the 60's, you know, all that hippie stuff, but except for the scenes w/Nicholson, it's a terrible movie.

"The Searchers" is on the AFI list as the greatest Western and is revered by audiences and great filmmakers like Scorcese and Coppola and Spielberg. This baffles me, I think it's positively awful, just a mess of a movie.

H

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Author: petunias One star, 50 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51616 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 2:09 PM
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The Deer Hunter

-petunias

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51618 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 2:55 PM
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What's missing here, perhaps, is the nostalgia factor. Sometimes a film, a former "classic" that does not hold up for a new viewer of a younger generation, still pleases because of the time in one's life it evokes - e,g., no not having been a gang member in NYC but remembering how the music and lyrics of an original cast album of West Side Story just seemed so damned perfect when first heard back in the day. The movie just does not seem quite as hokey to me as to some here.

I would like to see a faithful Broadway adaptation/revival. Until then, the DVD of the film will have to do if I feel that urge.

You know that New York is gone. The opening number was filmed where Lincoln Center was later built - that's NY's current West Side Story.

Ken

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Author: zathrus1 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51619 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 4:24 PM
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I agree with all of em except Forrest Gump, which I have a soft spot for, and the Searchers.

I think the thing that sets the Searchers apart is the scale of the basic quest the characters are on. The characters stick to a hopeless cause for years and years, never relenting. There aren't any car chases or anything, but I find the story inspiring in it's own way.

Just my $.02

And by the way - West Side Story is just a horrible, horrible, movie. When I've watched it, I've tried to put on the same nostalgia goggles I use to watch Brando in "The Wild One", but I just can't imagine a time when WSS was any good. Nice music, but laughably horrible overall.

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51620 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 5:18 PM
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"Nice music, but laughably horrible overall."

Great music. Great lyrics. Terrific dancing.

I guess "Romeo and Juliet" is also "laughably horrible overall"?

Ken

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Author: 0x6a74 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51621 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 5:31 PM
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"Nice music, but laughably horrible overall."

Great music. Great lyrics. Terrific dancing.

I guess "Romeo and Juliet" is also "laughably horrible overall"?



no, but all musicals of the 50s and 60s are laughably horrible.



(>:

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51622 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 5:39 PM
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"no, but all musicals of the 50s and 60s are laughably horrible."

IMO, only when and where they over-"reinterpreted" the Broadway show, whether Flower Drum Song, or Bye, Bye Birdie.

Oklahoma, Carousel, South Pacific, West Side Story, My Fair Lady, The Music Man (except for some Buddy Hackett silliness) - still great stuff. Still great music and lyrics, even separated from their source. And then there's the separate greatness of a "1776" in its own category, both on Broadway and in film.

PS: I've never seen The Sound of Music either way, only snippets, so I can't comment.

Ken

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Author: timjbd Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51623 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 5:57 PM
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You bastard.

The Sting was and IS a great movie.

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Author: 0x6a74 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51624 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 6:06 PM
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"no, but all musicals of the 50s and 60s are laughably horrible."

=============
IMO, only when and where they over-"reinterpreted" the Broadway show, whether Flower Drum Song, or Bye, Bye Birdie.

Oklahoma, Carousel, South Pacific, West Side Story, My Fair Lady, The Music Man (except for some Buddy Hackett silliness) - still great stuff. Still great music and lyrics, even separated from their source.


i don't know about "over-reinterpreted" (the only one i ever saw on any stage was HighSchoo production of 'guys & dolls')

... great music and lyrics, but the stories and the concept in general (singing during gang-fight?) laughable. Requires a huge 'suspension of disbelief' .. if you can't manage that, 'laughably horrible'

may be WSS is 'worse' because how could there be anything pretty about gang warfare? ( as opposed to WW-2 in SouthPacific (my personal favorite) )


..... i mostly joke. 'overrated' generally means, "everyone else seems to love this movie, but *i* just don't get it" (only one on OP's list i agree with is 'Forest Gump' ..largely because i don't like its politics)


=b

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Author: halco Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51625 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 6:11 PM
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You bastard.

The Sting was and IS a great movie.


There ya go! That's the spirit I was looking for!

H

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51626 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 6:45 PM
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Well, the same can be said in one way or another about all musicals (and operas too). Singing is a bit unnatural in a dramatic or even comedic context.

I guess one either likes them or doesn't.

I like them.

Ken

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Author: rharmelink Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51627 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 9:03 PM
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10 - West Side Story

I remember some comedian had the observation:

"Tony goes to an alley in the Spanish Barrio and yells "Maria!" -- and only one girl comes out on her fire escape in the alley."

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Author: 0x6a74 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51628 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/22/2008 9:18 PM
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Well, the same can be said in one way or another about all musicals (and operas too). Singing is a bit unnatural in a dramatic or even comedic context.

I guess one either likes them or doesn't.



True.

oddly (perhaps) ..i liked them when i was young, like them now that i'm old. Thought they were just TOO silly in between.


=

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Author: LaraAmber Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51629 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 8:56 AM
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I would add "Schindler's List" which was clichéd and laughably bad

Um, how can a true story be "clichéd"?

Lara Amber

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Author: GusSmed Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51630 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 9:24 AM
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I would add "Schindler's List" which was clichéd and laughably bad

Um, how can a true story be "clichéd"?


I thought it was excellent, but there is that terrible speech at the end.

- Gus

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Author: ibbieta Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51631 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 11:49 AM
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Um, how can a true story be "clichéd"?

I doubt very very very much that all the events depicted in that movie are based on Schindler's life during WWII. The basic frame of the story might be very true but here are examples that I remember from when I saw the movie (during theatrical release):

Woman is telling camp workers that they are building the thing wrong, head dude shoots her and tells camp workers to do it her way.

Guards interrogating prisoners in a line, shoot one of them, little boy says that he knows the guilty party and points to recently shot guy.

Head Nazi lazily sniping prisoners in the camp.

The final speech. Oh, that speech!

The Ben Kinsley character, every second he was on screen and everything he did.

The framing scenes before and after the whole black-and-white movie.

The sexual menace directed at the secretary woman by head Nazi dude that was obviously never going to go beyond that.

I hated the lame red-dress girl but I understand not everyone was watching a bunch of pre-color films at that time and seeing the same technique repeated. (It was popular to "paint" frames colors or color certain elements in the film before color photography came down in price.)

Speaking of the red dress girl, Schindler supposedly has his epiphany while riding a horse and seeing the rounding up and devastation of people's lives in the distance. A well-honored trick to remove the audience from emotional involvement in a scene is to film it as if it takes place in the distance. Spielberg fakes this by going in closer and showing details that Schindler could not have seen. Maybe I'm just forgetting the binoculars he used but that scene struck me as a cheat and seemed to gloss the fact that Schindler was in that muck earlier.

So, yeah, the story of a bad businessman saving some people's lives is nice and all but the movie about it was just not good. At the time, I believe Malaysia censored the film as "Jewish propaganda". I do not agree with the censorship, or that there is anything wrong with propaganda Jewish or otherwise, but I still think that is an accurate assessment of the movie. Without the built-in emotional weight of WWII and the Holocaust the movie was a nothing trifle. Think about this; imagine there was no holocaust or true story or that this was a science fiction story instead. How much of the movie is lost if the extra-element, true-storiness is taken away?

Most, all?

The movie pulled its gravity from history but fills its screentime with cheap ploys, cribbed from dozens of movies and stories before. The dichotomy between the loftiness the movie was attempting and the dreck it was shoveling to get there became amusing well before Schindler's heartwarming speech melted the hearts of war-weary, German soldiers causing them to disobey direct orders and spare the lives of strangers.

Oh, some more:
The head Nazi guy yelling out Heil Hitler or Germany before being hanged.

Every scene with the little scamp and his resourcefulness.

Every Jew in the camp was a wonderful, full person except that they were completely two-dimensional like everyone else in the movie.

How clean and nice the camp looked.

The smoke from the candle.

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51632 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 12:14 PM
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But the music was good.

Ken

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Author: LaraAmber Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51633 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 12:26 PM
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Okay,

Basing most of my reply upon what I could find on the net, since I'm at work, and my copy of the book Schindler's List is at home.

The girl in the red coat was based on an actual little girl who was known for wearing a red coat in the ghetto (she lived though, and wrote her own book about her experiences). So yes, there was some artistic license placing her in the movie, but there was also a reason for it.

Goeth (the head of the camp) really was a bastard. He would set his dogs on children. He really did have people randomly executed in a group for stealing, and someone else claimed the people he executed were the perpetrators. He had the rest of the group whipped. He actually did like to sit with a high power rifle and use prisoners for target practice. He also beat someone's head in with a brick. He did sadist mental games like play children's songs on loudspeakers while taking all the children away from their parents to be gassed. Considering he was diagnosed as mentally insane by SS doctors, it wouldn't surprise me if he did say "heil hitler" at the time of his execution.

So just from the information I could find on Goeth, I would say the camps were depicted accurately, but the acts performed were just so heinous, it's hard to believe they are true, instead of fiction dreamed up to make the audience cry.

Lara Amber

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Author: JimZipCode Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51635 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 12:45 PM
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So, yeah, the story of a bad businessman saving some people's lives is nice and all but the movie about it was just not good. ... Without the built-in emotional weight of WWII and the Holocaust the movie was a nothing trifle. Think about this; imagine there was no holocaust or true story or that this was a science fiction story instead. How much of the movie is lost if the extra-element, true-storiness is taken away?
Most, all?



I'm not sure that's an entirely fair question, since I think a great deal of Holocaust fiction takes as read a certain basic background of the broad facts surrounding the event. Since most people know about it, movies don't usually spend much time in setting up the detailed backstory from Hitler’s Nuremberg Laws to the Endlösung.

It was a pretty amazing experience in the theater. I dunno, I was younger then, not even 30, maybe I would react differently now; but at the time it was a pretty profoundly affecting experience.

Sometimes I think there's a bit of a rush to prove how intellectually superior one is, by disdaining a Spielberg film. The current Raiders pretty much sucks, and Private Ryan is pretentious and ultimately a little weak. But it's not like Spielberg has only made bad movies.

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Author: AngryCandy Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51636 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 12:51 PM
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I've pretty much disliked everything Spielberg's done since Temple of Doom, but I think Schindler's List is the best of the lot. Yes, the ending is atrocious. And certainly one has to question the whole idea of turning a story about the Holocaust into a heroic feel-good story (as amplified by the ending). But it's still a deeply affective film. Granted it's "easy" to score sympathy points by making a Holocaust film, but Spielberg reins in his more mawkish tendencies here and (for the most part) lets the powerful material speak for itself. It's not a great film, but it's a powerful one.

-chris

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Author: ibbieta Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51637 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 1:07 PM
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Goeth (the head of the camp) really was a bastard. He would set his dogs on children. He really did have people randomly executed in a group for stealing, and someone else claimed the people he executed were the perpetrators. He had the rest of the group whipped. He actually did like to sit with a high power rifle and use prisoners for target practice. He also beat someone's head in with a brick. He did sadist mental games like play children's songs on loudspeakers while taking all the children away from their parents to be gassed. Considering he was diagnosed as mentally insane by SS doctors, it wouldn't surprise me if he did say "heil hitler" at the time of his execution.

The dogs, the whips, the brick, and the children's songs were not in the movie that I remember. Those would have given the movie some edge and taken him to be a less sympathetic character. Maybe due to the quality of the other actors or the milquetoast writing, but his character was about the only interesting one in the whole movie and I began to root for him. In the movie he is simply a sort-of-evil, generic sadistic prison warden (maybe there is redemption for him). A chicks-behind-bars piece of trash film would have a more "evil" bastard in charge doing worse things.

But again, you are comparing the film to history and importing that history into the film. Think of it as a blank slate (as much as possible) and see what the film ITSELF gives you.

My best friends in college lived through the Khmer Rouge activities in Cambodia, losing parents, siblings, friends and nearly dying themselves. I heard some of their stories, of course, as well as from their families. But when watching "The Killing Fields" I drop those stories from my mind (as much as possible) and watch the movie as a self-contained entity. Where, as cinema, does it succeed and fail? Where is the engagement as a fictional story?

I'm not terribly concerned that the concentration camps were worse than depicted in Schindler's List but instead how did the depicted camps advanced the story or the emotional weight of the film. I would forgive many things, like too-clean camps or cute kids, if there was something in the film's acting, directing, or action that engaged me. With the ending given away before you even see the movie, where is the tension, where is the drama? I expect more from a documentary and this is fiction.

Maybe because Spielberg felt he had to tone down the evil to market his movie it ends up being as satisfying as a McDonald's hamburger -- approachable, convenient, simple, boring and cheap.

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51638 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 1:14 PM
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"In the movie he is simply a sort-of-evil, generic sadistic prison warden (maybe there is redemption for him)"

It's been a while since I saw the movie, but the character never struck me as less than vile, sub-human, and "the boy sure looked like plant food to me."

Redemption? No way!

Ken

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Author: ibbieta Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51639 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 1:36 PM
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Sometimes I think there's a bit of a rush to prove how intellectually superior one is, by disdaining a Spielberg film.

Hey, I was hating on Spielberg way before most people started. :) Although I do enjoy some of his movies with probably Jaws and Saving Private Ryan as the most enjoyable (not necessarily the best). I was probably the only person watching his TV show, too.

Still, he deserves the intellectual disdain as he admittedly reaches for the lowest common denominator -- biggest audience and most money. There is nothing wrong with that and he is obviously good at it but his movies are just not going to have as much to offer someone looking for a more intellectual experience.

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51640 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 1:45 PM
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"I was probably the only person watching his TV show, too."

Me too. Although I preferred Jim Henson's "The Storyteller" series to "Amazing Stories."

I liked "Duel," "Jaws," and "ET" (the original with the guns, even if I did not like the implication that the scientist was the bad guy).

"Schindler's List" was fine for what it was.

Ken

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Author: ibbieta Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51641 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 2:13 PM
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"Schindler's List" was fine for what it was.

Yeah, I don't want to have people thinking I hated the movie or thought it was the worst film of all time. I was just tired of people telling me how awesome and powerful it was.

Hence, overrated.

Not many people talk about the movie today, though.

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Author: JimZipCode Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51642 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 6/23/2008 2:22 PM
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And certainly one has to question the whole idea of turning a story about the Holocaust into a heroic feel-good story (as amplified by the ending).

You're just saying that because your boy Stanley said it.



Not many people talk about the movie today, though.


Keeps making it onto lists, though.

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Author: sykesix Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51764 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 7/9/2008 3:34 PM
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"Nice music, but laughably horrible overall."

Great music. Great lyrics. Terrific dancing.

I guess "Romeo and Juliet" is also "laughably horrible overall"?


Tough New York gang members dancing their way into battle pretty much pegs my horrible meter.

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Author: kenm47 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51765 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 7/9/2008 4:05 PM
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"Tough New York gang members dancing their way into battle pretty much pegs my horrible meter."

I'll take a guess you just don't care for American musicals (or Gilbert & Sullivan either), because dancing and singing ships full of sailors, cowboys, petty thieves, vengeful barbers, pointillist painters, elocution teachers and their students, murderous carnivorous plants, and 50s high school students/juvenile delinquents (to identify a few) are oh so much more believable.

You either accept the premise that folk will sing and dance or you don't. You don't, I guess you also don't go to any operas.

Works fine for me.

PS: I'm also one of the few people in the USA that watched ALL of "Cop Rock" and would have watched more if there was more. Also not having a problem with the occasional number on "Pushing Daisies."

Ken

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Author: 0x6a74 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 51768 of 63118
Subject: Re: My "Top 10 Great Overrated" List Date: 7/9/2008 4:31 PM
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I'll take a guess you just don't care for American musicals (or Gilbert & Sullivan either), because dancing and singing ships full of sailors, cowboys, petty thieves, vengeful barbers, pointillist painters, elocution teachers and their students, murderous carnivorous plants, and 50s high school students/juvenile delinquents (to identify a few) are oh so much more believable.

You either accept the premise that folk will sing and dance or you don't. You don't, I guess you also don't go to any operas.


don't know if that's "the premise" (i can't believe real folks just up and sing and dance, but some musicals work for me),

but the musical does require a special sort of 'suspension of disbelief'

interesting ,to me --saw a thing on the TV recently about the history of opera and the guy said that the transition from singing to speaking is so jarring, it's actually easier to write and believe opera than the musical.


=
..... also recently saw a thing about "American Graffiti" .they said that while casting, Lucas told everyone, "it's a musical" ..actors would say, "but I can't sing." "that's OK" "it's a musical and it's OK I can't sing??" ..and Lucas would just grin.

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