No. of Recommendations: 87
So....there are no words if u saw it today....freedom is a helluva thing people...most of us have never seen life without it..from the inside or the outside...so...whatever the reason we went there...the reality is that those poor, long suffering, people are free!,,,,and the USA/Britain went against the tide to do it....to all the naysayers,,doomsday boys....and accumulated egg suckers....what have u to say now?...."to whom much is given, much is owed"....clean out vermin nests before they get strong enuff to hurt us here....those troops over there are our kids...are our kids bad people?...OR ARE THEY GOOD PEOPLE?....history is changed by regular people doing great things...why we are there is not important as to what we are doing there now.....*&^% all wannabe hitlers...there is no room left in this world for even one tinhorn sadist with an army....none...you gotta be totally nuts to go against the USA...even with our warts..and we got plenty of warts...we are what we are...the last best hope of mankind....wear it proud..........tr
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No. of Recommendations: 3
Good words rat! We got the worst government on earth, except for all the others!
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No. of Recommendations: 7
rat (and anyone else who agrees with you):

It is easy in this historic moment to get carried away. Be careful.

You said: ...why we are there is not important as to what we are doing there now...

To me, this appears to be the moral equivalent of saying that the ends justify the means. I couldn't disagree more. Is that what you meant?
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No. of Recommendations: 50
Sorry to pee on the parade, rat. But this was the easy part. Was there ever any doubt that we would roll over Iraq? What ever happened to all those WMDs that we went to stop? Why were we there again? Maybe I can't keep track anymore. We ran out a dictator in a region filled with ruthless dictators. Now what do we do? We have managed to anger the few Muslims and Arabs who did not hate us already. Did we REALLY improve the security of the US? What did this exercise in unilateral pre-emptive "defensive" war gain us? I can sure figure out what it cost us, no matter how often they replay the video of the Hussein statue being pulled down. Now all those crazed looting masses are our problem. Just like we took care of the Afghans (where the Taliban are taking over again), and even Panama (one of the largest drug transfer countries in S America). God bless our troops, but the administration has used a lot of pages out of the playbooks of past tyrants.

CH- Naval Academy grad and retired Navy pilot.
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No. of Recommendations: 7
<< Now all those crazed looting masses are our problem. >>

I don't think a few looters should be perceived as masses of thieving Iraquis...I'm sure the "average" Iraqui is a decent person just trying to get by and find a little happiness. Nor would I presume that we have now angered "the few Arabs and Muslims who did not hate us already." So, all those Iraquis who were dancing in the street in celebration of their first taste of freedom were actually hating us? Could'a fooled me...

I'm not naive...I know there's a long way to go and we're in this for the long haul. But this was a tremendous victory, both for the beleagured Iraqui people and for the U.S. We have eliminated a vicious enemy in Sadaam Hussein.


rex
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No. of Recommendations: 32
WW:

What ever happened to all those WMDs that we went to stop?

We're still looking for them.

Why were we there again?

To eliminate Iraq's WMD, and remove from power those who were willing to use them.

Now what do we do?

We try to help the Iraqis learn to govern themselves democratically.

Did we REALLY improve the security of the US?

Compared to the alternative, definitely. You know that, left alone, Saddam would, sooner or later, either actually use his WMD against us or his neighbors, or use the threat of them to increase his power tremendously at our expense. Now, that won't happen.

What did this exercise in unilateral pre-emptive "defensive" war gain us?

Some security, in time lower oil prices, greater security for Israel because less resources will now flow to the Palestinians, and the not insignificant possibility that democracy will take root in the Middle East with attendant benefits for the whole world. It is not clear to me how the North Koreans will react to this.

Now all those crazed looting masses are our problem.

Yes, but I'd much, much rather have that problem than the one we just got rid of.

Just like we took care of the Afghans (where the Taliban are taking over again),

The jury is still out on how the Afghan situation will end up.

and even Panama (one of the largest drug transfer countries in S America).

True, we haven't solved the drug problem yet. Still working on it.

God bless our troops, but the administration has used a lot of pages out of the playbooks of past tyrants.<i/>

No tyrant in history has ever taken the kind of care we have to avoid civilian casualties and preserve culture. Also our different intent matters, because in the end we are hoping to give all of the Iraqi people a real stake in their government. Just ask the people of Germany and Japan whether they'd like to go back to the way they were governed before WWII.

You know, it may not work out. But if life means anything at all, it means not being ruled by pessimism or cynicism.

And if you make the perfect the enemy of the good, you'll never accomplish anything.
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No. of Recommendations: 4
I know there's a long way to go and we're in this for the long haul.

Time for yet another classic line from Pulp Fiction; Winston Wolf (played by Harvey Keitel) says to Jules and Vincent after they finish cleaning up the inside of the blood-splattered car:

"Alright, let's not start sucking each other's d**ks just yet."


Lots of work yet to be done; here's hoping we do it right, and we're appreciated, cause there's a lot of work left to be done here at home as well.


fiddy
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No. of Recommendations: 0
<< "Alright, let's not start sucking each other's d**ks just yet."


Lots of work yet to be done; here's hoping we do it right, and we're appreciated, cause there's a lot of work left to be done here at home as well.
>>


A lot of work left to be done here at home...please elaborate.


rex


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No. of Recommendations: 1
Pulp Fiction was one of the DVDs found in one of Saddam's palaces.

Draw your own conclusions.
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No. of Recommendations: 1
joelxwil Pulp Fiction was one of the DVDs found in one of Saddam's palaces.

Is there an inventory of such available on internet? I'd very much like a chance to review that. Please post reference for your finding.

tia, matson


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No. of Recommendations: 3
"Was there ever any doubt that we would roll over Iraq? What ever happened to all those WMDs that we went to stop? Why were we there again? Maybe I can't keep track anymore. We ran out a dictator in a region filled with ruthless dictators. Now what do we do?"

1. Go to DisneyWorld.

2. Build a DisneyWorld-Baghdad

3. Get Haliburton in to preserve the oil fields for the Iraqi people.

4. Buy a SUV

5. Have the feds give big contracts out to fiber optic producers <fingers crossed>

6. Have the feds give an even bigger contract to AOL-TW to help bring this backward area of the world online at a monthly rate. <everything crossed; been an AOL long way too long...>

I'll leave 7 to 10 of this list to others.

Ken
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No. of Recommendations: 2
To me, this appears to be the moral equivalent of saying that the ends justify the means. I couldn't disagree more. Is that what you meant?


yes,,,exactly...what else matters but the end result?...u tell me?..save a life?..by cheating, lying, and stealing?..seems right to me.tr
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No. of Recommendations: 1
u can pee anyplace u want WW..just not on my blue suede shoes....u got that right.nice...isn't it?.tr
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No. of Recommendations: 3
yes,,,exactly...what else matters but the end result?...u tell me?..save a life?..by cheating, lying, and stealing?..seems right to me.tr

you left out "by taking lives" - although i'm sure saddam himself would have killed just as many of his own people as the U.S. did over the next few years and probably by much more painful methods. who's lives are we talking about saving by the way? americans or iraqis? IMHO anyone who seriously believes bush got us into this war to "help" or "liberate" iraqi civilians as he now implies non-stop has seen way too many disney films. BWTFDIK
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No. of Recommendations: 6
those troops over there are our kids...are our kids bad people?...OR ARE THEY GOOD PEOPLE?

Some of each--same as Iraqis, British, French, Australians, North Koreans, Tanzanians, Eskimos, Ladakhis...

We had overwhelming military might on our side. This DOES NOT make us morally superior. It simply means we had overwhelming military might on our side. (Witness Tibetans v. Chinese).

Let people be judged on their own character, and not simply that they served in the military. Anything less is to do them a disservice.


we are what we are...the last best hope of mankind

Agreed. That's why I don't want to see us squander our power unwisely and perpetuate the cycle of violence, which IMO is what we've done in Iraq. Time will tell.
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No. of Recommendations: 3
That's why I don't want to see us squander our power unwisely and perpetuate the cycle of violence, which IMO is what we've done in Iraq. Time will tell.
-----------

Time will kill.

When diplomacy fails and violence is thrust upon you, how do you respond?

There is no social evolution, merely an idea. People are the same as they always were and the same as they always will be. A violence-free utopia will not happen here on earth. Good to try to avoid violence, but not always avoidable.

ab - Rat sees it too

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No. of Recommendations: 0
Number 1 for the day. Well done.

http://boards.fool.com/BestOf.asp
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I'll leave 7 to 10 of this list to others.

ok Ill take #7 & #8


7. Dedicate an even larger slice to GDP to keeping troups in Iraq.
8. Raise Interest Rates so we can still attract Forign $$$ to feed our debt.

-Q
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No. of Recommendations: 2
I'll leave 7 to 10 of this list to others.

ok Ill take #7 & #8


7. Dedicate an even larger slice to GDP to keeping troups in Iraq.
8. Raise Interest Rates so we can still attract Forign $$$ to feed our debt.

-Q


Here's #9:

9. Now that Turkey is whining about a possible Kurdish state in N. Iraq, remind the Turks that maybe they should have let us base there in the first place, thus avoiding our need for increased Kurdish military assistance thereby placing a huge bargaining chip in their stack.
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No. of Recommendations: 0
OK. Jumping back in for 10. If what I'm currently reading and hearing about what folks think about the whereabouts of those pesky WMD:

10. Liberate the Syrian people!

Ken (Where are Mort Sahl and Paul Krassner now that we need them? Never mind, we do have Jon Stewart and The Daily Show.)
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No. of Recommendations: 0
7. Dedicate an even larger slice to GDP to keeping troups in Iraq.

It'll be the same slice. We already had troops there getting shot at. I 'spect we'll pull some out of SA and Kuwait and restation them.
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No. of Recommendations: 13
I know that!....we in this war for very obvious reasons...Did USA enter the war against Hitler to save the Jews?....gimme a break...lots of good comes out of mudballs....this is the real world....not the world of the "moral hi-grounders"...who accompish nothing..and yappity yap yap alot...would u rather have these skells exloding themselves on the streets of NYC?...or over there?.....I live in the world as it is..not as I would like it to be...remember Vietman?...a bad war...in a bad place..fought for dumb reasons...but.....once u in that foxhole..that is your world..all the moral hi ground nonesense aside...u fight and kill to stay alive...to keep your bros alive..that is the real world...u think we can control any of it?.....heck no..the naivity?!!!!stuns me again!!!!!!!!!....sure....who cares why?..all I care is what comes out of it......the unreal naivity kills me once again!!!!!!!!....no one marched more against that stupid war in that stupid place...then we lost our student deferrments..and we got drafted....anyone remember?....I was not Muhammed Ali...and I wasn;t about to run off to Canada with rat tail between my cheeks....so we did what we had to do...this is not the same...people need to grow up..and see this corrupt world for what it is...........if a diamond comes out of an old septic tank...is it not a diamond anyways?....Yeeeesh.....suffer a little...gives perspective....good for the soul too....I say...screw em all...we haven't had a good leader since Truman...what else is new?....everyone here knows I am the last anarchist standing......but I know what is good...and what is bad...and bad needs to be eliminated.wherever it is.....and I want the threats against "My people..called by My name" alleviated...cause those that stand with the people of the Lord...are my people too.a pOX on the rest.nuff said for now....OIL this!!!!...tr
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No. of Recommendations: 21
OK///what are the names of the kids?....hmmmm..sound Hungrian, Hebrew, Japanese, Chinese, Polish, Irish, French, German, Rumainan, Russian, Hatian, Spanish,German,,Americans?....all the people of the world are Americans....we are the children of the world!!!!!!!...we are the last great hope of this world....screw the leadershit we have now...and next time around...we are the Arabs too!!!!!!!!...and the Africans....and the Alabanians...We are the accumulated seed of the world..the children of freedom.....who else should come and help?...screw the politicos..screw the $$$$$$$$$$ reasons...


moral hi-ground this!!!!!....I am sick of it..sit in the UN...and suck that crap up all day....2,000,000 died in Rwanda...what did the UN do????????????????BAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH...not a damn thing...if the USA doesn't act..than no one does.....Israel would be a hole in the ground if the UN had looked after that little country......POX on UN also...Wyatt Earp style.....that is reality......"some people need hanging"....
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No. of Recommendations: 9
"Sorry to pee on the parade, rat. But this was the easy part. Was there ever any doubt that we would roll over Iraq? What ever happened to all those WMDs that we went to stop? Why were we there again? Maybe I can't keep track anymore. We ran out a dictator in a region filled with ruthless dictators. Now what do we do? We have managed to anger the few Muslims and Arabs who did not hate us already. Did we REALLY improve the security of the US? What did this exercise in unilateral pre-emptive "defensive" war gain us? I can sure figure out what it cost us, no matter how often they replay the video of the Hussein statue being pulled down. Now all those crazed looting masses are our problem. Just like we took care of the Afghans (where the Taliban are taking over again), and even Panama (one of the largest drug transfer countries in S America). God bless our troops, but the administration has used a lot of pages out of the playbooks of past tyrants.

CH- Naval Academy grad and retired Navy pilot."

Me too.

SSG Me, Echo Recon 1/7th Cavalry, 1stAirCavDiv

Thanks Wolverine
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