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Author: TheDope1 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 1950951  
Subject: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 4:49 PM
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...right now on anybody who says we can't touch entitlements *cough*Harry Reid*cough*. Simpson also stressed how health care spending isn't the problem. We spend 2x what other nations spend and don't get 2x the outcomes.

He mentioned tort reform and a litany of other things that need to be done. But they saved most of their venom for not doing anything about Social Security. Bowles said fine, don't do anything today at all. Then don't cry when you draw a check in 25 years that's 25% less than it is today.
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Author: GrumpyOldGuy Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837148 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 5:24 PM
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Sheesh Dope, a couple of (minor) tweaks to SS, cut back on payments to Doctors and hospitals (they won't mind), cut some of the fraud, problem solved. You are a worry monger trying to get people to buy into the Republican doomsday scenario but we are smart enough to see what you are doing.

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Author: markand4504 Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837150 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 5:34 PM
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Sheesh Dope, a couple of (minor) tweaks to SS, cut back on payments to Doctors and hospitals (they won't mind), cut some of the fraud, problem solved.
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So if SS and medicare aren't causing the deficit, what is? Is it the wars which cost $100bil/yr or the tax cuts on the top rate which cost $70bil/yr? Or is it both? Lets see thats $170bil/yr. What's the deficit again?

Mark

PS 'problem solved' was funny

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Author: TheDope1 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837157 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 5:47 PM
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Sheesh Dope, a couple of (minor) tweaks to SS, cut back on payments to Doctors and hospitals (they won't mind), cut some of the fraud, problem solved. You are a worry monger trying to get people to buy into the Republican doomsday scenario but we are smart enough to see what you are doing.


LOLOLOL. Yep, doctors make too much money. Let's not pay them as much. They'll keep seeing the same volume of patients anyway.

Plus, our $80 billion tax increase will go a long way towards solving our $1 trillion budget deficit.

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Author: HMALETTER Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837183 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 6:18 PM
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...right now on anybody who says we can't touch entitlements *cough*Harry Reid*cough*. Simpson also stressed how health care spending isn't the problem. We spend 2x what other nations spend and don't get 2x the outcomes.

He mentioned tort reform and a litany of other things that need to be done. But they saved most of their venom for not doing anything about Social Security. Bowles said fine, don't do anything today at all. Then don't cry when you draw a check in 25 years that's 25% less than it is today.
______________________

Tort reform is even more minor than taxing the wealthy, but have at it, it won;t make a dent.

And how did we get from the best health care system in the world, to one where we spend too much and don;t get the best outcome?

People have known about the medicare and SS issues since before Bush 41 got thrown out for raising the tax.

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Author: DufusGoneSplat Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837185 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 6:18 PM
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So if SS and medicare aren't causing the deficit, what is? Is it the wars which cost $100bil/yr or the tax cuts on the top rate which cost $70bil/yr? Or is it both? Lets see thats $170bil/yr. What's the deficit again?

Mark


Take a look at the following spreadsheet;
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2...

as taken from the Office of Management and Budget;
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/historicals/

Note the "On-Budget" columns and the "Off-Budget" columns.

Today there are only two off-budget entities that were once on-budget: the Social Security system and the U.S. Postal Service.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/taxe...

The larger and better known programs under the Social Security Act and amendments are:

Federal Old-Age (Retirement), Survivors, and Disability Insurance
Unemployment benefits
Temporary Assistance for Needy Families
Health Insurance for Aged and Disabled (Medicare)
Grants to States for Medical Assistance Programs (Medicaid)
State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)
Supplemental Security Income (SSI)
Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_%28United_State...

Anyway, notice the Off-Budget (Social Security and Medicare, i.e.) shows a surplus, and the On-Budget (the budget congress and the President negotiate) has the deficit.

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Author: BlueGrits Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Recommended Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837188 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 6:24 PM
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I can see how doctors in Texas are jumping up and applauding the $250K limit for non-economic losses.

The paraplegics they left behind? Not so much....

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Author: TheDope1 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837192 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 6:30 PM
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Tort reform is even more minor than taxing the wealthy, but have at it, it won;t make a dent.

I wouldn't say that. Medical schools now bring lawyers in to brief the students on what the legal environment is should they screw up. That scares sufficient new doctors into ordering defensive tests.

And how did we get from the best health care system in the world, to one where we spend too much and don;t get the best outcome?

They did cite the infant mortality statistic which is bu11$hit. Other countries that supposedly rank ahead of us don't count preemies and rig their data in other ways.

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Author: richieds Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837204 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 7:12 PM
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"Plus, our $80 billion tax increase will go a long way towards solving our $1 trillion budget deficit."

That 80 billion is for one year. Were you expecting to cut the budget deficit to zero in one year?

Again, if it's so little, why would you risk a financial collapse just to fight for the wealthy?

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Author: TheDope1 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837208 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 7:16 PM
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That 80 billion is for one year. Were you expecting to cut the budget deficit to zero in one year?

I was hoping to not have to call Washington "pathetic", which is what token gestures like this are.

Again, if it's so little, why would you risk a financial collapse just to fight for the wealthy?

Financial collapse, eh? How are reforming entitlements going to cause a financial collapse?

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Author: richieds Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837212 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 7:21 PM
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"Financial collapse, eh? How are reforming entitlements going to cause a financial collapse?"


Easy. There will be NO entitlement reform without tax hikes on the wealthy. It's called compromise and the GOP will have none of it.
They would rather watch the economy burn and win the mid-term elections.

You keep forgetting this is a two party system and, by the way, those lower tax rates you think are indispensable we in place throughout the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression.

Cause and effect? No, but certainly no reason to believe our economy couldn't survive higher taxes on the wealthy. Heck, I think it did pretty well with it in the late 90's.

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Author: TheDope1 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837219 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 7:47 PM
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Easy. There will be NO entitlement reform without tax hikes on the wealthy. It's called compromise and the GOP will have none of it.

One wonders where you studied negotiations. So all this is the GOP's fault. You know, you could just type "This is all the Republicans' fault" and use it as a sig line.

Tell me, what did Reid just say about Social Security? Are you aware? And did you read what Simpson/Bowles were saying about it higher up in the thread? BTW: Boehner said he'd do more revenue as his opening position.

You keep forgetting this is a two party system and, by the way, those lower tax rates you think are indispensable we in place throughout the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression.

And....? I assume you're trying to make a point that having low marginal tax rates across the board caused the housing bubble with this....let me go ahead and LOL @ that.

Cause and effect? No, but certainly no reason to believe our economy couldn't survive higher taxes on the wealthy. Heck, I think it did pretty well with it in the late 90's.

Oh, good. You don't earn a gold star, though. The economy blossomed in the mid 90's due to widespread simulataneous adoption of the PC in bidness + the internet. The combo created a massive productivity boom and the .com bubble.

In other words, we could afford those rates.

Back to you. How do raising taxes by $80 billion close Obama's $1 trillion yearly hole? And fix entitlements?

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Author: markand4504 Big red star, 1000 posts Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 1837240 of 1950951
Subject: Re: Simpson/Bowles on CNBC going off... Date: 11/15/2012 8:56 PM
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Back to you. How do raising taxes by $80 billion close Obama's $1 trillion yearly hole? And fix entitlements?
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Because he is going to make them pay their fair share and the fairness is greater than $1 trillion....plus the $80 billion.

Sincerely,

liberals, 7 year olds and lobotomized elk

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