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Author: prim69 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 5068  
Subject: Social security Date: 9/3/2003 8:10 PM
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A question for those of us not in your country, related to the "will you depend on social security?" thread.

Is SS in the states means/asset tested at all? From what I read, it seems it isn't, & everyone who is entitled by age/retirement receives something.

But here if your assets or income exceed a certain limit, SS cuts out. Based on both parties incomes if you are married. So anyone who is truly financially independent at retirement is by definition not entitled to SS.

That's what I based my response to the poll on. If I reach my financial retirement objective, the govt won't give me any money cos I'll earn too much (that's the plan, anyway!!)

So am I interpreting your situation correctly? Or am I completely missing the point?

Primm
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Author: FoolNBlue Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 649 of 5068
Subject: Re: Social security Date: 9/3/2003 9:01 PM
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Is SS in the states means/asset tested at all?

Yes. If you were born after 1965 or so, it means you will pay and if you were born before, it means you will receive.

But here if your assets or income exceed a certain limit, SS cuts out. Based on both parties incomes if you are married. So anyone who is truly financially independent at retirement is by definition not entitled to SS.

That's what I based my response to the poll on. If I reach my financial retirement objective, the govt won't give me any money cos I'll earn too much (that's the plan, anyway!!)


No, SS in the States is not means tested and all who pay in are "entitled" to certain proscribed benefits tied to taxes paid. That is, the more SS wages earned (and taxes paid) the more you get out.

The purpose of the poll was to ascertain how many of us believe that the fund will be solvent (certainly someone here believes in the Toothfairy) and/or that the republicrats will not change the law so that we are ineligible regardless of what we paid in.

Personally, I don't trust that SS will be around for me when "I am eligible." SS is just another tax.

FoolNBlue (Not born yesterday.... but, unfortunately, after 1965)

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Author: prim69 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 651 of 5068
Subject: Re: Social security Date: 9/3/2003 10:10 PM
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No, SS in the States is not means tested and all who pay in are "entitled" to certain proscribed benefits tied to taxes paid. That is, the more SS wages earned (and taxes paid) the more you get out.

OK, so what you're saying is that what you pay in SS taxes goes into some sort of SS "fund" as a separate part of Treasury, which you have access to when you retire - is that right?

Boy, our system sucks then. I mean, I knew it did, but this confirms it.

SS taxes here get put into consolidated revenue. Then when you reach retirement age, provided you have accumulated enough assets or earn enough income, you get NOTHING back.

However if you haven't saved anything over your lifetime, the govt picks up the bill when you retire, by paying you a pension, because you don't earn enough from your retirement savings to survive on your own.

Kind of a disincentive to save, but I don't think the system will be around when I retire, or will at least have substantially changed, so that's why I plan on providing for myself. The way it works at the moment, when all the baby boomers have retired, there won't be enough people working to provide their pensions.

But you still hear older people on the bus saying "I'm entitled to this - my husband worked all his life!" Yeah, lady, so have I (so far, anyway).

Primm
*doesn't believe ANYTHING the government tells her!*


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Author: fredinseoul Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 658 of 5068
Subject: Re: Social security Date: 9/4/2003 5:34 AM
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Primm,

if you check out www.ssa.gov , you can get a good explanation. It isn't so nice to some of us.

Basically, if you meet the minimums, you get the money. I have met the minimums, but have 35 years to get the maximum payoff. I don't like the system too much.

fredinseoul

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Author: FoolNBlue Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 659 of 5068
Subject: Re: Social security Date: 9/4/2003 7:27 AM
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OK, so what you're saying is that what you pay in SS taxes goes into some sort of SS "fund" as a separate part of Treasury, which you have access to when you retire - is that right?

Yes, but the "fund" is made up of a bunch of IOUs. Our lovely government (run by retired folks and boomers) would rather spend the money now and let my generation sort out the (ie pay for) mess when the fecal matter hits the fan. An analogy would be telling your child that you will keep their college money for them and then buying yourself a boat with their money. When it's time to go to college (retire) the school is not likely to take your parent's IOU.

Of course, the government can either cut benefits (political suicide), tax the still working stiffs (my generation) even more, or inflate their way out. Either way, the prior generations get their cut of my money and I'll get squat! Scariest to me is that they will probably do a combination of "means" testing on those not already drawing SS funds, squeezing me and mine out of getting any benefits, and inflating their way out (devaluing the nest egg I've worked and saved and that will be my only means of support).

FoolNBlue (A realist.... although the reality is very pessimistic!)

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Author: tmeri Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool CAPS All Star Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 670 of 5068
Subject: Re: Social security Date: 9/4/2003 10:49 PM
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prim69 is curious:

Is SS in the states means/asset tested at all?

Yes, it is. There is a limit to how much income you can make without reducing your SS. Your assets, however, do not in themselves reduce SS.

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