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Susan said,

"But, by and large, mutual funds are (and I suspect will remain) the most potent corporate lobbying tools simply because they concentrate the two essential elements of shareholder action (monetary clout and issue-specific motivation) in one convenient package. "

When mutual fund managers can be found who are not sharks, please let me know. Managers are rewarded only for maximizing profits, usually only short-term ones. Corporations, including mutual funds, are money-maximizing machines, specifically engineered to remove non-financial issues like ethics from the decision making process. Since even "socially responsible" funds are evaluated on the basis of returns, and found wanting, I doubt they can buck this trend.

"Gimme a break.
Susan (who doesn't mean to be cranky, but is a little tired of arguing with paper tigers)"

Susan, I wasn't attacking you personally, so I would have expected the same treatment. I don't advocate the nuts-and-berries existence that you elaborate on. I just advocate honesty, and let's face it: all of us investors are thieves, pure and simple. Theft is not socially responsible. Let's not polish our halos about how we are exploiting workers only at "good" companies. Let's admit that, since food, clothing, heat, health care, running water and college tuition are only for the privileged few in this world, we are stealing to have them. And let's also work on gettting them provided to all on some minimal decent basis. Otherwise, we are much worse than paper tigers, we are hypocrites.

I won't continue the thread because I'm sure it's not welcome here. I didn't intend to get into this argument, but also I didn't ask for a lecture on phony morality, just *historical data*. If you attack, expect to defend.

An honest thief,

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