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Author: Silencer2480 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 22704  
Subject: Tuition Date: 9/24/2012 3:01 PM
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Hi all,

Hope everyone is doing well. For those who have school aged children, I am wondering what the concensus is on the current and future levels of tuition. In the NYC area, the cost for jewish day schools seems to be in the 15-25k range (potentially higher). Even for just two kids, this would seem to be unaffordable for all but the very highest earners. Is the situation similar in other parts of the country? What are you and your peers doing if anything (changing schools, having fewer kids, all of the above?) I asked some catholic friends for a variant perspective; the said they pay $2-3k and wouldn't even consider sending if the cost was over $7k.

I have read about some proposed solutions, but it just seems the situation is unsustainable.

sorry to be glum, but curious as to your experiences.

silencer
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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22060 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/24/2012 3:40 PM
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All my kids went to public schools, and so are my grandkids. No need to throw money away.

Elan

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Author: Silencer2480 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22061 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/24/2012 4:05 PM
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All my kids went to public schools, and so are my grandkids. No need to throw money away.

Elan


Sure. But it seems the best way to preserve jewish identity and affiliation in kids is via a jewish day school environment. Maybe there is some confounding variables since more actively engaged parents are more likely to send to day schools, and it's really the involved parents that make all the difference.

Were you worried about your kids' jewish identity Elan, or did you figure you'd be able to give them enough at home?

silencer

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Author: markr33 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22062 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 12:10 AM
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But it seems the best way to preserve jewish identity and affiliation in kids is via a jewish day school environment.

I've heard many in the Conservative Jewish movement say that summer camp has a similar affect of retaining a Jewish identity in their children. But the bad news is that summer camp can cost $7-9k at most Conservative Jewish camps. For example - http://www.campramahne.org/prospective-families/dates-rates/...

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Author: dovbaer6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22064 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 10:20 AM
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I asked some catholic friends for a variant perspective; the said they pay $2-3k and wouldn't even consider sending if the cost was over $7k.



The Catholic Church has subsidized parochial schools for decades, maybe centuries, hence the lower cost. I guess that is one of the advantages of having a monolithic organization, as opposed to the Jewish world which is so decentralized.


Too bad a guy like Shelly Adelson isn't putting a few hundred million into subsidizing Jewish private schools in America, as he does with Birthright in Israel.


may you be sealed ..... Dov

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Author: markr33 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22065 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 12:52 PM
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Too bad a guy like Shelly Adelson isn't putting a few hundred million into subsidizing Jewish private schools in America, as he does with Birthright in Israel.

The ~240,000 children in Jewish private schools paying ~$14,000 each means that the total tuition bill is over 3 billion dollars a year.

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Author: dovbaer6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22067 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 1:32 PM
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Too bad a guy like Shelly Adelson isn't putting a few hundred million into subsidizing Jewish private schools in America, as he does with Birthright in Israel.


The ~240,000 children in Jewish private schools paying ~$14,000 each means that the total tuition bill is over 3 billion dollars a year.


chump change for Shelly .... :)

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Author: markr33 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22068 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 2:46 PM
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LOL. An annuity to pay for all those kids would be about $100B. And an annuity to pay for all Jewish kids would be much more than that!

Chag Sameach!

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Author: dovbaer6 Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22069 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/25/2012 2:59 PM
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Shelly can manage it!


;)

Chag Sameach!

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Author: midastouch017 Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22070 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/26/2012 5:14 AM
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chump change for Shelly .... :)
-------------------------------------------
Too bad Sheldy is busy spending monies into
destroying free press in Israel!!!

:-(

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22071 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/26/2012 2:12 PM
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Too bad Sheldy is busy spending monies into
destroying free press in Israel!!!

:-(


In Israel he's got the prime minister in his pocket. Now he's trying to do the same in America.

Elan

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Author: midnightG Two stars, 250 posts Old School Fool Global Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22078 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 9/29/2012 8:49 PM
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Hi Silencer,

There is no doubt that the cost of tuition is very high.
I live in the NY Metropolitan area.

But Yeshiva tuition is by far the best INVESTMENT you can make for your kids (and for yourself).

It's hard enough to battle all the garbage that society throws at our kids. Sending them to public school would make that battle all the more harder.

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Author: isophorone Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22081 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 10/2/2012 9:44 AM
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Too bad [Shelly] is busy spending monies into
destroying free press in Israel!!!

:-(


In Israel he's got the prime minister in his pocket. Now he's trying to do the same in America.


Chump change for George Soros, also. In America, he has the President in his pocket. Now he is trying to do the same to Israel.

;)

In the DC area I am pretty sure that Jewish day school expenses easily exceed $15,000/year.

Ron

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22083 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 10/2/2012 1:47 PM
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In Israel he's got the prime minister in his pocket. Now he's trying to do the same in America.

Chump change for George Soros, also. In America, he has the President in his pocket. Now he is trying to do the same to Israel.


Both are corrupting influences which should be illegal. When campaign contributions are so large that they buy a person access and influence, they are bribes. They disenfranchise every one of us.

Elan

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Author: isophorone Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22097 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 10/9/2012 2:06 PM
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Both are corrupting influences which should be illegal. When campaign contributions are so large that they buy a person access and influence, they are bribes. They disenfranchise every one of us.

I am more of a believer in free speech, but clearly, governments have given great incentive for men like Adelson and Soros to make their large contributions. Is this a great country or what? ;)

Ron

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22098 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 10/9/2012 2:21 PM
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I am more of a believer in free speech

The huge mistake the supreme court has made is to equate giving money with free speech. Giving money is not speech. It's a bribe.

Elan

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Author: stevenjklein Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22158 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/18/2012 10:53 PM
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When campaign contributions are so large…

You think $2,500 is "so large"?

Because that's the maximum an individual can contribute to a candidate in any given election.

Even if we throw in contributions to national, state, district, and local party committees, the limit is still shy of $50,000.

(Source: http://www.fec.gov/pages/brochures/contriblimits.shtml)

There are probably hundreds of thousands (or millions) of individuals who contribute that much. Even If Obama met with 100 such individuals every day, he couldn't meet them all before his term expires.

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22159 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/18/2012 11:30 PM
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When campaign contributions are so large…

You think $2,500 is "so large"?

Because that's the maximum an individual can contribute to a candidate in any given election.


I wasn't refering to direct contributions within those legal limits. It's the super-pacs and other dark-money schemes that funnel tens and hundreds of millions of dollars to campaigns that are supposedly not coordinated with the candidates themselves. This flood of money permitted by the Supreme Court's Citizens United decision is bribery on a massive scale.

Elan

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22160 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/19/2012 12:15 AM
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Here's a good summary -

http://www.citizenvox.org/2012/11/13/citizens-united-still-n...

Elan

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Author: stevenjklein Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22161 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/19/2012 9:19 AM
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It's the super-pacs and other dark-money schemes that funnel tens and hundreds of millions of dollars to campaigns that are supposedly not coordinated with the candidates themselves.

Not just "supposedly." People have gone to jail for coordinating independent expenditures with official campaign organizations.

One example can be found in Act One of This American Life episode 463, found at this link: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/463/m...

This flood of money permitted by the Supreme Court's Citizens United decision…

Had the Supreme not overturned McCain–Feingold, spending by Adelson and Soros would NOT have been affected. The McCain–Feingold Act does not regulate spending by individuals.

The Citizens United decision affected only spending by corporations and unions. Given the wording of the first amendment, I don't really see any way to change this without a constitutional amendment.

FWIW, I actually favor an amendment that would limit spending to qualified electors. By that I mean that only individuals could contribute to campaigns, and then only to campaigns in which they are permitted to vote. So no rich Californians donating to a Senate race in Massachusetts, and no wealthy Utah Mormons contributing money to fight gay marriage in California.

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Author: elann Big gold star, 5000 posts Top Favorite Fools Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22164 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/19/2012 11:34 AM
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It's the super-pacs and other dark-money schemes that funnel tens and hundreds of millions of dollars to campaigns that are supposedly not coordinated with the candidates themselves.

Not just "supposedly."


Yeah, sure. This reminds me of a scene in a recent episode of the HBO series Boardwalk Empire. It's set during Prohibition. The gangster proposes to the U.S. secretary of the treasury who secretly owns a distillery to run it for him. The offer is accepted with the condition that they never talk to each other again.

Had the Supreme not overturned McCain–Feingold, spending by Adelson and Soros would NOT have been affected. The McCain–Feingold Act does not regulate spending by individuals.

The supreme court has made it easier for the likes of Adelson, Koch and Soros too, by allowing them to spend through corporations which hide the identity of the spenders. What may be legal can still be very embarrassing to a candidate if there is full disclosure. There are hundreds of millionaires who, unlike the characters above, still have some shame, or make contributions solely as political bribes, and would not contribute if their identity had to be disclosed.

FWIW, I actually favor an amendment that would limit spending to qualified electors. By that I mean that only individuals could contribute to campaigns, and then only to campaigns in which they are permitted to vote. So no rich Californians donating to a Senate race in Massachusetts, and no wealthy Utah Mormons contributing money to fight gay marriage in California.

I agree. That is what Public Citizen is trying to do, in one form or another.

Elan

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Author: stevenjklein Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22167 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/19/2012 2:31 PM
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I agree.

Hooray! I love it when we find something about which we can agree.

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Author: stevenjklein Big funky green star, 20000 posts Feste Award Nominee! Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22170 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/23/2012 10:41 AM
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For our four kids our total bill comes to about $24,000 / year. And that's with three kids in kindergarden, where the rate is slightly lower.

It's big enough to be a contributing factor in our decision to make aliyah.

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Author: Silencer2480 Big red star, 1000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 22171 of 22704
Subject: Re: Tuition Date: 11/23/2012 11:05 AM
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For our four kids our total bill comes to about $24,000 / year. And that's with three kids in kindergarden, where the rate is slightly lower.

It's big enough to be a contributing factor in our decision to make aliyah.


I'm sure it is. Even on a lower salary in Israel, you could easily have more disposable income.

silencer

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