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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: of 58627  
Subject: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter is+ Date: 12/13/2012 2:11 PM
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lower in calories than regular peanut butter, right? I mean it's healthier so it must have fewer calories....

Yep--just read this on another forum....I mean no wonder we're a nation of fatties....

utter...total....mind-boggling stupidity....

end of rant....for now...
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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57448 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/14/2012 12:02 PM
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Wow. You'd think that in a nation where we are saturated with information regarding the nutritional contents of pretty much everything we eat, people would be better informed.

That said, our diabetic friend with the LVAD ended up back in the hospital a few days after Thanksgiving because instead of eating turkey for Thanksgiving, his wife insisted that they stick to their "Vegan" diet and had her mom make vegetarian chili for them instead. What she didn't realize was that the extra sodium content of the tofu, canned beans and tomatoes that were in the chili pushed his body to the limit after he'd eaten it for two meals and he went back into congestive heart failure from the fluid retention.

LWW

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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57449 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/14/2012 4:33 PM
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Wow. You'd think that in a nation where we are saturated with information regarding the nutritional contents of pretty much everything we eat, people would be better informed.

I know--especially since nearly every food has nutritional labels giving the information. How much effort does it take to just read the d@mned thing? I think it's a case of denial--just make assumptions and 'hope' they're right. Goes to the heart of 'I can't count calories' really meaning 'I just don't want to bother counting calories'. And "I want to eat as much as I want, but just limit it to certain categories and the calories will magically disappear into thin air because some diet guru has labelled the food 'healthy'. "

As H.L. Mencken said--no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57450 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/14/2012 6:08 PM
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I wonder how many people don't read the labels properly? When DD#2 was in high school, I realized she didn't understand how you had to multiply the calories per serving by the number of servings. She and her friends had been dividing it instead.

LLW

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Author: VeeEnn Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57451 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/15/2012 6:33 AM
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Yep--just read this on another forum....I mean no wonder we're a nation of fatties....

utter...total....mind-boggling stupidity....


I'm not terribly suprised by this to be honest.....as depressing a thought as that might be. I don't think it's so much stupidity as the fact that we all have something of a credulous believing brain to some degree......and the advertising world knows how to make full use of it.

Terms like "natural", "organic", "holistic" etc. are bandied around and sell a lot more products or services than you'd expect. Look at how "low fat" managed to pursuade so many folk that, say, Snackwell cookies and soda and whatnot were reasonable additions to a nutritious diet......and look at how the low carb gurus are now making out like bandits by pursuading those same folk that their obesity is due to faulty advice rather than their own credulity or that weight management is not a matter of calories in vs calories out etc. etc.

I'm no better. I'm a sucker for skin care products and slick marketing and would spend money like there's no tomorrow but for the fact that so much stuff I squandered my $$bucks on has caused me to break out.

You have to shake your head at it all.

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Author: VeeEnn Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57452 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/15/2012 6:40 AM
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FWIW, I'm fascinated by this aspect of human behaviour and I can recommend a couple of books....both written by Michael Shermer...The Believing Brain and Why People Believe Weird Things

http://www.amazon.com/dp/1250008808#_

http://www.amazon.com/People-Believe-Weird-Things-Pseudoscie...

They're bothe easy reads as Shermer is quite an amusing writer.

It's a good idea if reading either one, though, to not chuckle too hard at other folks daftness as most everyone turn comes before the end of the bokk.

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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57453 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/15/2012 11:02 AM
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Yep--just read this on another forum....I mean no wonder we're a nation of fatties....

utter...total....mind-boggling stupidity....

I'm not terribly suprised by this to be honest.....as depressing a thought as that might be. I don't think it's so much stupidity as the fact that we all have something of a credulous believing brain to some degree......and the advertising world knows how to make full use of it.

Terms like "natural", "organic", "holistic" etc. are bandied around and sell a lot more products or services than you'd expect. Look at how "low fat" managed to pursuade so many folk that, say, Snackwell cookies and soda and whatnot were reasonable additions to a nutritious diet......and look at how the low carb gurus are now making out like bandits by pursuading those same folk that their obesity is due to faulty advice rather than their own credulity or that weight management is not a matter of calories in vs calories out etc. etc.


I know. I know. I know. It is soooo predictable--I think I wrote a few threads back about how people engage in the following thought process: food X is 'healthy' because it's 'natural', 'organic', 'low carb', 'low fat,' 'paleo', 'primal' or whatever the latest fitness/diet guru advocates. And being at your ideal weight is also 'healthy', so eating food X will cause you to arrive at your ideal weight--calories aside. I guess people believe what the want to believe.

I'm no better. I'm a sucker for skin care products and slick marketing and would spend money like there's no tomorrow but for the fact that so much stuff I squandered my $$bucks on has caused me to break out.

You have to shake your head at it all.


Well, I've seen those infomercials too--the skin products, the hair products....they sound sooo compelling that you feel almost negligent if you don't buy it.

However I will tell you what works--works as close to miraculously as you can imagine and (you should appreciate this) takes less time than a dental cleaning--botox and juvederm. Pricy for sure, but sooo very, very worth every penny.

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Author: VeeEnn Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57454 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/15/2012 11:35 AM
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and (you should appreciate this) takes less time than a dental cleaning--botox and juvederm.

Is that where you got it done?

Almost all my cronies who're still practising in the UK have been into that for years now and I see that it's now being pushed here in the US.

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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57455 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/15/2012 2:37 PM
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Is that where you got it done?

Oh Lord NO! Never would. I get it done by a board-certified plastic surgeon.

"...While you may see advertisements for Botox in salons, spas and maybe a party or two, Botox is a real medical procedure, with the potential to cause serious problems, even death....

...So, who should perform your Botox? While plastic surgeons and dermatologists are the obvious choice, properly trained ophthalmologists and otolaryngologists are also reasonable alternatives. These four groups all receive appropriate instruction during their residency training programs.

What about family doctors, emergency medicine doctors, dentists, podiatrists, and everyone else who is trying to get into the act, courtesy of their weekend crash courses? Let’s just put it this way … I’m legally allowed to perform colonoscopies, but you wouldn’t want me doing that to you. Why? I’m not formally trained in colonoscopies. Doctors who add Botox and other cosmetic procedures to their menu of patient offerings are taking advantage of their medical licenses in this era of declining insurance reimbursement for the procedures that they were trained to do. It reminds me of Suttons Law: Why did Willie Sutton rob banks? Because that’s where the money was.

Bottom line? Like all medical procedures, choose your doctor carefully, and don’t view Botox like you view a manicure."


http://www.doctoroz.com/blog/arthur-perry-md-facs/agony-and-...

I went to a Plastic Surgeon vs a derm because I figured he had more weapons in his arsenal--that he wouldn't waste my time with non-surgical injectables if I really needed something more invasive. I was bracing myself for recommendations of upper bleph, lower bleph, endoscopic forehead lift and a litany of other surgical procedures that I would require--turned out my case was just a matter of a few injections. Nothing more. I keep asking him if I need surgery, and he looks under my chin, around my face, and says 'not yet.' What a relief! But the botox and filler make a remarkable difference imo. Truly amazing.

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57456 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/16/2012 10:56 PM
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I know. I know. I know. It is soooo predictable--I think I wrote a few threads back about how people engage in the following thought process: food X is 'healthy' because it's 'natural', 'organic', 'low carb', 'low fat,' 'paleo', 'primal' or whatever the latest fitness/diet guru advocates. And being at your ideal weight is also 'healthy', so eating food X will cause you to arrive at your ideal weight--calories aside. I guess people believe what the want to believe.

I'm down more than 15lbs since last year. Most of it since last July. I haven't counted a single calorie. Most of it started to move when I started eating a paleo diet.

So people can believe what they want to believe, but I'll believe the results I've seen on the scale. As soon as I cut out grains and dairy, the belly bloat went away and the the scale started to move again.

LWW

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Author: VeeEnn Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57457 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/17/2012 8:54 AM
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I'm down more than 15lbs since last year. Most of it since last July. I haven't counted a single calorie. Most of it started to move when I started eating a paleo diet.

So people can believe what they want to believe, but I'll believe the results I've seen on the scale. As soon as I cut out grains and dairy, the belly bloat went away and the the scale started to move again.


But it's worthwhile to consider that "cutting out grains and dairy" meant you were automatically consuming fewer calories regardless of whether you were counting them or not. I've read similar accounts when folk went *low-carb* and cut out all cookies, candies, soda etc. etc...

If you weren't counting these calories, you wouldn't know in reality, would you.....you'd just believe that you were probably consuming the same amount.

That's what happens when folk "believe"

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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57458 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/17/2012 12:50 PM
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I'm down more than 15lbs since last year. Most of it since last July. I haven't counted a single calorie. Most of it started to move when I started eating a paleo diet.

So people can believe what they want to believe, but I'll believe the results I've seen on the scale. As soon as I cut out grains and dairy, the belly bloat went away and the the scale started to move again.


Sorry if I offended you by my paleo reference, LWW--and I am truly happy for your remarkable results. But I firmly believe that even though you aren't officially counting calories in your paleo diet, the elimination of whole groups of food has caused you, nonetheless, to eat fewer calories. So, imo you are reducing calories whether or not you are counting them.

My objection is when many more people than I care to name (not here at TMF btw) think that simply following the latest diet craze will cause them to lose weight. There are people who think that they can eat 'as much as you want' of the uneliminated foods on elimination diets (be it limiting/eliminating fat, carbs, sugar, grains, gluten, meat, and on and on and on...) will magically result in weight loss despite the calories in the uneliminated foods. Yes, those diets work for some because it happens to cause them to consume fewer calories. But for even more (imo) it causes either no weight loss, insignificant weight loss or weight gain because people who go on diets already have lost the ability to 'know' when they are 'full' or 'no longer hungry' or 'satisfied.'

My point is calories matter--calories always matter--whether you count them or not.

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Author: zoningfool Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57459 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/17/2012 12:58 PM
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But it's worthwhile to consider that "cutting out grains and dairy" meant you were automatically consuming fewer calories regardless of whether you were counting them or not. I've read similar accounts when folk went *low-carb* and cut out all cookies, candies, soda etc. etc...

If you weren't counting these calories, you wouldn't know in reality, would you.....you'd just believe that you were probably consuming the same amount.

That's what happens when folk "believe"


That's was what I was getting at in my prior post (didn't see your response).

Btw viv--I didn't mean to disparage dentists' abilities regarding the botox injections--I am sure they are some who'd do even a better job than a PS (doing injections--botox or filler--is an art as much as a science), but I wouldn't want my dentist doing my filler/botox (even though it would be immeasurably more convenient to get a cleaning/checkup and a botox touch-up all in one fell swoop), and I wouldn't let my plastic surgeon do a root canal or crown on me either. Each has their own specialties and I respect that delineation.

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Author: VeeEnn Big gold star, 5000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57460 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/17/2012 2:23 PM
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Btw viv--I didn't mean to disparage dentists' abilities regarding the botox injections

Not to worry......it struck me as a bit strange when it first started to take off back in the UK (ages after I left) I've changed my mind a bit WRT just the Botox and whatnot if that's what you know is all you need. As one of my girlfriends pointed out......who would you want injecting a paralysing agent into you........someone who spends every day giving precise, painless injections and knows the anatomy of the muscles of facial expression and their nerve supply like the back of their hand ('cept, they wouldn't know those muscles quite so intimately)......or a plastic surgeon.

Thing is with this, right, if you want someone to make you look *better* (and Botox injections might be only one part of that) you want someone who can do the full deal. That's not going to be your dentist......not that they'd be licensed anyways. My daughter dated a well respected local cosmetic surgeon for a while..... and dropped him sort-of because she thought he was a bit too frivolous (I think it was the $1500 worth of BLING he bought her for *no good reason*.....her words... that was the decider <<GULP>>) Where did I go wrong?!!

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Author: legalwordwarrior Big funky green star, 20000 posts Old School Fool Add to my Favorite Fools Ignore this person (you won't see their posts anymore) Number: 57461 of 58627
Subject: Re: You all do know that 'natural' peanut butter Date: 12/18/2012 12:22 PM
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Sorry if I offended you by my paleo reference, LWW--and I am truly happy for your remarkable results. But I firmly believe that even though you aren't officially counting calories in your paleo diet, the elimination of whole groups of food has caused you, nonetheless, to eat fewer calories. So, imo you are reducing calories whether or not you are counting them.

Not offended at all. Just noting that you don't have to actually count the calories when the food you eat is nutritionally dense. I agree that my calorie consumption ois bound to be down, as there are no empty calories in the diet. But it does explain why people have much better results with low carb and paleo. You eat enough not to feel hungry, even though the calorie concentration is significantly less.

My point is calories matter--calories always matter--whether you count them or not.

But they matter less to the person on the diet when you don't have to actively count them to keep on track.


LWW
down another lb this week :0)

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