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Not sure if this is the same survey as was posted a few days ago, but i didn't feel like going back and checking:

http://illinoispolicy.org/blog/blog.asp?ArticleSource=5156

The Physicians Foundation has completed one of the largest and most comprehensive physician surveys ever conducted in the United States. The new survey covers a number of topics, ranging from what they think about ObamaCare to how satisfied they are in their careers, from whether they will continue to accept Medicare and Medicaid patients to what they think about the current state of the medical profession. The whole thing is worth reading, but here are a few highlights:

•A whopping 61 percent of doctors said they would retire today if they had the ability to do so. That's up from 45 percent in 2008.

•More than 68 percent of doctors have a negative view of the current state of the medical profession. Just 3.9 percent have a "very positive" view.

•Nearly three-quarters of all doctors have a pessimistic view of the future of the medical profession. Just 3.1 percent have a "very optimistic" view.

•More than 59 percent of doctors have a more negative view of the medical profession as a result of ObamaCare. Just 18.5 percent of doctors have a more positive view as a result of ObamaCare.

•Nearly 56 percent of doctors believe that more widespread use of health savings accounts will improve quality and reduce costs.

•Nearly 73 percent of doctors believe that less government regulation will improve quality and reduce costs.

•More than 35 percent of doctors have closed their practice to Medicare and/or Medicaid patients. That's up from 24 percent in 2008.
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Obama has gone and done the opposite.
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2828 posts, "•A whopping 61 percent of doctors said they would retire today if they had the ability to do so."


I'm fairly certain that about 98% of most people would retire if they had the ability to do so.

In fact I'd say that 100% of animal caretakers would retire if they had the ability to do so.

Probably 100% of Dentists would probably retire if they had the ability to do so. Can you imagine poking around in someone's nasty mouth all day long? Yuck!

Catch my drift? Who wouldn't retire if they had the ability to do so. Very few people who win the lottery keep working. A few keep working for a little while and then they come to their senses and quit.

Art
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Probably 100% of Dentists would probably retire if they had the ability to do so.
----------------

Not mine. He's told me so. He only works 4 days a week anyway. He has a great office - they all get along and take cruises together. A couple of times a year he declares a few "snow days" because the weather is so nice. They reschedule everyone and take off for the bay or something. He's happy with what he's doing. He decided to become a dentist when he discovered the Navy wasn't what he wanted to do. He hadn't graduated high school at that point, so I don't think the Navy gave him fun jobs. So some people enjoy their work, and dentistry is a way to help others.

arrete - I'm happy I'm retired, though.
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My PCP, who is about my age, did not say he'd retire in 2014 when PPACA goes into effect in 2014 but he did tell me he'll stop seeing new patients when PPACA goes into effect. His daughter started Boston University this fall so I figure once she graduates he'll RE.

Mike
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My PCP, who is about my age, did not say he'd retire in 2014 when PPACA goes into effect in 2014 but he did tell me he'll stop seeing new patients when PPACA goes into effect. His daughter started Boston University this fall so I figure once she graduates he'll RE.
____________________

My cardiologist did not threaten to walk away, he is a young man.

He did almost threaten to change my meds and refer me to a psychiatrist when I mentioned my daughter was thinking of Med school.
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Who wouldn't retire if they had the ability to do so. Very few people who win the lottery keep working. A few keep working for a little while and then they come to their senses and quit.

Art

-------------------------

I think I would start a business if I won the lottery. What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind...
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Guppy wrote: I think I would start a business if I won the lottery. What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind...

Whoa! That's not the right answer for this group. Ask me. I know.

<teasing>
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I think I would start a business if I won the lottery. What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind...


Guppy738


Psst. This is a retire early message board. Personally I've yet to meet a retiree who is bored and wished they were employed again. Of course I am an ISTJ introvert so I will have the proper personality type to enjoy RE when I RE.

Mike
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"What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind... "


Lots of rich folks never retire...Bill Gates...Warren Buffet...Richard Branson.....


on the other hand, tele had no problem retiring at 52.5....and now at 66 have enjoyed a lot of things.

No...I don't have an executive jet, fly all around the world hobknobbing with other rich folks, own 8 homes.....and need a staff of 50 to clean and maintain them all. I don't have a 100 or 200 foot yacht.

I keep busy most days.....and enjoy myself. SOmetimes taking an afternoon nap is a nice pleasure. WAs warm and humid yesterday so just fell asleep watching some TV......no problem.

Went and saw Atlas Shrugged Part II.....Monday matinee...
$5....... about 30-40 in the theater at the time......aaved a few
bucks and no giant crowds....

then off to dinner after nap....

today is accordion club meeting...

still have to unpack the car from the radio auction.....bought a few things and crammed in the back seat.....guess I better get to it.....
all the stuff needs a cleaning before coming into the house...10 years of grime and dust on some of it....so I'll use up a roll of paper towels....

Windows wide open.....a few sprinkles around...in the high 70s and cloudy..no sun....



I could be sitting in an office cubical working away, piling up more cash that Uncle Sam will get 55% of some day.....so why?

Work is over rated!.....unless you love what you are doing.....like Steve Jobs...Bill Gates...Warren Buffet......Richard Branson....




t.
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My PCP, who is about my age, did not say he'd retire in 2014 when PPACA goes into effect in 2014 but he did tell me he'll stop seeing new patients when PPACA goes into effect.

My hernia surgeon did not want to make a political statement when I asked him if he would quit if ObamaCare was passed. He said he didn't want to quit since he loved his work, but his facial expression gave him away.

--fleg
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"I think I would start a business if I won the lottery. What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind." - guppy


I stay very busy grocery shopping, cooking, eating, and doing dishes. I can barely keep up with myself.

Artie
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I stay very busy grocery shopping, cooking, eating, and doing dishes. I can barely keep up with myself.

Artie
-----------------------------------------------------------
Dishes? Shopping? Let the maid get it. Yer doin' it wrong!
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"Guppy wrote: I think I would start a business if I won the lottery. What are you going to do if you retire? I would be bored out of my mind...
-------------------
"Whoa! That's not the right answer for this group. Ask me. I know." <teasing>" catherine



You'd be surprise how you get used to being retired and your schedule fills up with errands and day to day stuff. Today I had a dentist appointment. Stopped at Sam's to rotate tires. Ate lunch while waiting. Filled car with gas. Stopped at Bank and took out some cash.

Did big pile of dishes last night. This morning had to unload dishwasher. Swept floor.

I run errands for my wife, try and find mite medicine for my brother's bees (sort of similar to what I did when I was the manager of animal facilities),

Read, play on computer, watch Netflix movies, pick up sticks after storms in our yard, do a little traveling, go grocery shopping, cook, clean, ....

I also like watching prime time TV shows. Big Bang Theory, 2 1/2 Men, Vampire Diaries, Dexter, Boardwalk Empire, Treme, Homeland, Being Human, Tony Bourdain, Top Chef, Iron Chef, .....

I manage to entertain myself pretty well. And there's always playing house with my wife. <grin!>

Artie
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"Dishes? Shopping? Let the maid get it. Yer doin' it wrong!" - 2828


I'm much better at it than my wife is. She's real good at working and making money and I'm real good with anything having to do with food and cooking/cleaning.

I'm no fool. I know which side my bread is buttered on. I've got a good thing going here and I play my role as best I can to keep riding this wave as far into shore as it will take me.

Keeping wifey happy is part of my plan.

Artie
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"Dishes? Shopping? Let the maid get it. Yer doin' it wrong!" - 2828


I'm much better at it than my wife is. She's real good at working and making money and I'm real good with anything having to do with food and cooking/cleaning.
----------------------------------------------------
I thought we are talking about winning the lotto? If you won the lotto would you still be doing it? I guess i probably would, but i wouldn't be doing yard work or cleaning house that's for sure. I guess it all depends on the jackpot.
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Dishes? Shopping? Let the maid get it. Yer doin' it wrong!

Maid Service For The Masses? Pathjoy Offers Affordable Housecleaning With Easy Web Booking

http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/16/pathjoy-launch/?utm_source=...

To make that happen, Cheung and her brother/co-founder Aaron are offering four main twists on the traditional cleaning service model. First, she said Pathjoy is more affordable, charging only $20 an hour, compared to the $40 charged by most other cleaning services. Second, it's more convenient, because you can book, cancel, and reschedule cleanings from the Pathjoy website, rather than having to call.

Now, some of those goals may seem a bit paradoxical. How can you promise high quality if you're charging less? Cheung said it's because she and her brother actually spent some time working as cleaners after they decided to launch a cleaning startup, so they've figured out how to take a lot of the inefficiencies out of the industry.
____________________

That's a remarkable synchro -- Obama has actually spent some time working as a physician so he could figure out how to take a lot of the inefficiencies out of the health-care industry.

--fleg
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"I thought we are talking about winning the lotto? If you won the lotto would you still be doing it? I guess i probably would, but i wouldn't be doing yard work or cleaning house that's for sure. I guess it all depends on the jackpot." - 2828


Well that hasn't happened yet so I'd best keep doing what needs to be done to keep everything on an even keel. I'm really good at that. I used to always thinking of it as "riding that wave as far into shore as it will take me." That was when I was working at the Uni. of TN Vet School.

The truth is that I started thinking about retirement when I was about 30 years old and I took that Economic Development Course taught by Dr. Evan Brown at the University of Georgia. He had his financial consultant from Merrill Lynch come in and talk to us and he wrote up on the board and talked about the formula for compound interest and investing so much money per year in like a 401K or IRA and retirement and I was hooked right there.

I knew I had to do that so as soon as I got my first real full time job, working as the Lab Animal Superviser for the University of Georgia School of Pharmacy I started putting money away each month in a 401K. When I left there two years later I had all ready saved up $8,000 which was a lot considering I was only making like $14,000/year.

Bonnie got an offer at the Uni. of Tenn. working for their Agriculture Experiment station editing technical publications. She was technical science editor. It was while she was working there that she took the course work to get her PhD which was all free because when you work for the Uni. of Tenn. they allow you take up to 8 semester hours free each semester as long as you make up the time.

So anyway here I am. And yes I still buy lottery tickets. Equal to about two cups of Starbucks coffee a week and since I don't drink coffee I figure that's fair.

King Arthur
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A few comments in not particular order...

It would be interesting to see a generational breakdown of the numbers. I know plenty of older physicians (I'm not there yet) that don't want to retire and the reasons are many. Being a physician defines them. They don't have any other hobbies. They don't like being around their family and vice versa.

Being a physician is what I do for a living, its not who I am. I could retire tomorrow (if it were feasible) and not look back. There would be some aspects that I'd miss, the people I work with, the occasional enjoyable patient, etc., but just like when I turned in my football helmet for the last time, I missed it but moved on. It will be the same with the stethoscope.

I recently filled out a survey for my alumni association website. One question, what advice would you give to someone wanting to go into your profession. Answer, don't.

I'm sick and tired of all the talk about making medicine more efficient, cutting waste, etc. Where is all the talk about personal responsibility?

On CNBC this AM, they had the head/chairman/what ever of The Cleveland Clinic. He was talking about all the efficiencies they've found/created in their system. One of his selling point, all physicians are salaried, i.e., doesn't matter what they do or how much, they get $x per year. Fine. But he is a desk jockey that I'm sure by now has lost touch with those 2AM calls, long weekends, and holiday interuptus. Again, no mention of the patient being responsible.

People don't understand how insurance distorts prices. DW had to have her car windshield replaced the other day. Big rock, high speed, big crack. Initially the quote was around $1000. When they found out it was cash (high deductible) the price went down to $600. Similar thing happened when a neighbor's tree fell on my garage. Initial repair estimate $3000. Cash (again high deductible) down to $2000.

That is all for now.

JLC
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People don't understand how insurance distorts prices. DW had to have her car windshield replaced the other day. Big rock, high speed, big crack. Initially the quote was around $1000. When they found out it was cash (high deductible) the price went down to $600. Similar thing happened when a neighbor's tree fell on my garage. Initial repair estimate $3000. Cash (again high deductible) down to $2000.

That is all for now.

JLC


Exactly. Eliminate third party payments for most medical situations and the health insurance issue solves itself.

Mike
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People don't understand how insurance distorts prices.

Health insurance companies have the ability to negotiate prices. The same is not available to patients.

Where is all the talk about personal responsibility?

Not certain where this is going. There are patients that aren't going to follow instructions. It is likely that you are referring to more than the lose weight/more exercise instructions common given to many patients.

It can be difficult for sick or elderly patients to understand and follow instructions. Medication side effects can cause confusion, and themselves make it difficult to follow instructions.

I am certain that you also see patients with serious conditions that aren't taking the necessary steps to manage their condition.
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Health insurance companies have the ability to negotiate prices. The same is not available to patients.

Prime example is Lasik eye surgery. Never covered by insurance. Price has dropped since being introduced. How did that happen? Free market have anything to do with it? Definitely not the insurance companies negotiating better pricing.

If you're talking about non-elective/emergency care, that is what insurance is supposed to be for. The unexpected car wreck, not the regularly scheduled oil change/tire rotation.

There are patients that aren't going to follow instructions.

Bingo.

Obamacare's answer is to punish the hospital/physician for bad outcomes even though they are obviously the patient's doing. Many of these small town/local hospitals/physicians are going to close shop because they will no longer be able to afford to participate. They give away enough free/non-reimbursable care as it is, this only makes it worse.

Of course I'm cynical enough to think the end point of saving money through Obamacare is not through more efficient delivery but through LESS people getting care because LESS physicians and hospitals are participating.

JLC
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It is both unrealistic and stupid to punish hospitals and doctors for non-compliant patients.

If you're talking about non-elective/emergency care, that is what insurance is supposed to be for.

I don't see how the playing field is even for a patient to attempt to negotiate with a hospital or large clinic. Even for treatment that isn't emergency.

For routine blood tests for monitoring chronic conditions, the difference between the billed and insurance amounts can be 70-80%.

My husband has had a very bad year. With $100K in medical bills, I am sensitive as to not being in a position to negotiate. In addition to treatment (at least partially) covered by insurance, he has $800 a month for treatment from a provider that doesn't accept insurance. Their rates are above what would be reinbursement rates from insurance.
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I stay very busy grocery shopping, cooking, eating, and doing dishes. I can barely keep up with myself.

Artie



Not to mention becoming a SME ("Subject Matter Expert") on NDEs and the Holographic Universe. <grin>
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The truth is that I started thinking about retirement when I was about 30 years old and I took that Economic Development Course taught by Dr. Evan Brown at the University of Georgia.


I started thinking about retirement at age 27 when Paul Terhorst's book came out. I snatched it up as soon as it hit the stands and tore into it with gusto. He really made me see what is possible and changed my thinking.
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Not certain where this is going. There are patients that aren't going to follow instructions. It is likely that you are referring to more than the lose weight/more exercise instructions common given to many patients.


I don't follow all my doctor's instructions. Yet again today, she nagged me about my high cholesterol and wanted to put me on a statin. I flatly refused.

For about two minutes I thought she was also going to put me on yet another blood pressure drug, but I escaped that one. My BP was 147/97 when the nurse took it on her digital, but a little while later in the doc's office she did it again with her manual device, and it was 120/82. Go figure.
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I don't follow all my doctor's instructions.

There is obviously levels of non-compliance. Deciding not to take a prescription because you have evaluated the risk is very different from someone who has had surgery and doesn't take appropriate care to avoid infection.
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In addition to treatment (at least partially) covered by insurance, he has $800 a month for treatment from a provider that doesn't accept insurance. Their rates are above what would be reinbursement rates from insurance.

I've told how this works before, but maybe you missed it so I'll regurgitate one more time. In a more condensed version.

The only physicians that effectively set their own rates are plastic surgeons. You pay or you don't. Insurance is almost never involved (for truly cosmetic cases).

Medicare/Medicaid set their rates. Physicians participate or don't. M/M set their rates based upon "local customary charges". They look and see what physicians used to charge for things, varied from state to state and city to city. They then pay X%. In most of my cases 15-30%. I can take it or leave it.

Insurance companies then turn around and say we will pay X times M/M. Usually 2 or 3. I can take it or leave it.

These things are reviewed on an annual basis, roughly.

You or your husband come to me. We're friends, hard luck story, etc., etc., etc., I say I'll cut you a deal, don't worry.

Next year rolls around, M/M see that my average customary charge has dropped. Their new rate is now 1/2X%, lower than before. Private insurance comes in and sees the same thing, their rates drop. And the death spiral begins toward zero.

So yes, the "customary charge" is inflated. Its a self defense measure. So know you can hopefully see where third party payers (government and insurance) has screwed up medical economics, especially when it comes to routine care. Insurance is supposed to be for emergencies and catastrophes.

Now as far as negotiating for routine blood tests, I see plenty of quick care, doc in the boxes advertising lists of test and what they cost. And I know my town isn't on the cutting edge of medical economics. Maybe you should look around.

JLC
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I don't follow all my doctor's instructions.

Your doctor should not be penalized because you choose not to follow her recommendations.
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Now as far as negotiating for routine blood tests, I see plenty of quick care, doc in the boxes advertising lists of test and what they cost. And I know my town isn't on the cutting edge of medical economics. Maybe you should look around.

JLC


Most of the doc in boxes have closed. In some ways that maybe good. Been to one once for urgent care, and it did not work out well.

Even if they haven't closed, given my husband's current medical condition, there is no way a doc in the box is sufficient.
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>> Prime example is Lasik eye surgery. Never covered by insurance. Price has dropped since being introduced. How did that happen? Free market have anything to do with it? Definitely not the insurance companies negotiating better pricing. <<

Also, compare the cost of human medical care compared to the cost of similar procedures performed by veterinarians. I understand that there are some extra costs in human procedures, but not the orders of magnitude sometimes seen. If people had "vet health insurance" the same way they usually have their own low-deductible health insurance, a $500 veterinary procedure would probably cost $3,000.

#29
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I don't follow all my doctor's instructions.

Your doctor should not be penalized because you choose not to follow her recommendations.


But that is exactly what is in Obamacare.

JLC
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>> Your doctor should not be penalized because you choose not to follow her recommendations. <<

Still, it's hard to be too careful in this litigious culture.

Some doctors will refuse to keep seeing patients who refuse their recommendations. Some will continue to see them, but only if the patient signs a document that says they are refusing to follow the doctor's recommendation -- so the doc will have this as a legal defense in the future if need be.

#29
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