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URL:  https://boards.fool.com/but-without-actual-evidence-we-are-at-an-34153452.aspx

Subject:  Re: Libet and free will revisited Date:  3/9/2019  6:10 PM
Author:  btresist Number:  26761 of 27155

...but without actual evidence we are at an impasse...

Recall my position. I contend that one should generally trust conscious experience unless there is good evidence against, otherwise it is really hard to live a normal life. Like me, you've said that you experience free will and now you say there is no "actual evidence" for or against.

So why do believe you lack free will in the absence of "actual evidence" against?

I can measure the mass of something, its reactivity, its magnetism, etc. I can't measure it's consciousness (at least not yet, if such is in fact a property of matter). Without that ability it appears consciousness is a possible by-product of complexity.

How is it possible that stuff that can be measured can give rise to something that cannot be measured? At very least, it is no more-or-less plausible for the "unmeasurable" to arise from measurable complexity (your position) as it is for it to be a general characteristic of matter (my position).

I could ask you the same.

You could, but I am not asserting something isn't conscious as you are with a lump of iron or the sun. I am suggesting that consciousness is a property of matter and can only be detected by personal experience. I am wondering what your claim is based on.

The Big Bell Test is really just a version of the EPR verification using quasars.

The Big Bell Test assuming free will gave the same results as "the EPR verification using quasars". This indicates that human choices are at least as unpredictable as astronomical methods of generating randomness, which strongly suggests that human choices are not predictable by classical determination.

Back to nonrandom indeterminacy.
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