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No. of Recommendations: 11
http://business.time.com/2012/11/28/fiscal-cliff-why-congres...

Eliminating the deduction for retirement savings would hit the well-off disproportionately, a condition with a lot of appeal in the current political climate.

Translation: Anything that hoses 'the rich' is a.w.e.s.o.m.e.

So hold on to your wallet. Congress has many options when it comes to tapping this vast reservoir. It could eliminate the deduction altogether or just for top earners, further restrict the amount that is deductible (currently $17,500; for those over 50, $23,000), start taxing retirement savings growth, or take back the part that has grown tax-free.

Translation: The only promises that matter are the ones we make to bundlers and unions. If you're not in one of those groups, we can take your property and you can shove it.
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No. of Recommendations: 0
So hold on to your wallet. Congress has many options when it comes to tapping this vast reservoir. It could eliminate the deduction altogether or just for top earners, further restrict the amount that is deductible (currently $17,500; for those over 50, $23,000), start taxing retirement savings growth, or take back the part that has grown tax-free.
____________________________

Or they could take the entire balance, then they could give back to you as a government sponsored annuity that pays you the maximum amount of social security and subtracting the payment you receive from your annuity' from your SS amount in the name of fairness

In other words

You have 500,000 dollars saved

Your SS payment would be 18,500

Your annuity payment would by 17,900

So our combined annuity/SS payment would be 18,500-17,900 which would
mean you qualify for 600 added to your annuity from SS so your combined payment would be 18,500

Because you saved, there is no reason for SS to be given to you on a means tested basis except for the 600 dollars that brings you to an amount determined to be a living stipend.

SS is saved and everyone gets what is coming to them.
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No. of Recommendations: 22
Civil war will come if they try to take American's guns or 401k's.

If that happens, it really is over for me. It will be like being a Jew in 1930's Europe. It's all over.

That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.

decath
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No. of Recommendations: 4
That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.
_________________________

I have said many times, I see violence on the horizon.
Where we are now, I do not see how it is avoided. It is a natural consequence of the path Obama has chosen and the animosity he has flamed from both sides toward each other.
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lowstudent wrote: Where we are now, I do not see how it is avoided. It is a natural consequence of the path Obama has chosen and the animosity he has flamed from both sides toward each other.

I, too, don't see how violence can be avoided. When cities run out of money to pay for law enforcement, as is occurring in Oakland, CA, violence will beget violence and then we're Greece.

Oakland Crime Rate Soaring as City Loses Officers
http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2012/11/28/phil-matier-oakl...
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No. of Recommendations: 3
"One of the earliest fears about tax-favored savings accounts like IRAs and 401(k) plans was that when this pool of savings grew large enough Congress would not be able to resist tapping it to help solve the nation’s debt problems. We’re about to find out if those fears—persistent for decades—have been justified."

galeno was right.

Mike
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No. of Recommendations: 17
One of the earliest fears about tax-favored savings accounts like IRAs and 401(k) plans was that when this pool of savings grew large enough Congress would not be able to resist tapping it to help solve the nation’s debt problems. We’re about to find out if those fears—persistent for decades—have been justified.

I have believed this ever since I started paying into my firm's retirement plan back in the 70s. The idea that people would be in a lower tax bracket in the future seemed just plain dumb. The idea that Congress wouldn't change the rules whenever they find it expediant is just dumb. There is no place you can go to avoid the grasp of the money-stealers in DC, other than leave the country and renounce citizenship. Given that there is no reasonable place to go that isn't already more screwed up than America makes it dumb to move, so just bend over, because here it comes. I just hope I am allowed to keep enough to live on for the duration of my life, but Obama and the Dems considered retired folk to be unworthy of consideration, so goodbye Medicare (but you must pay the premiums anyway) and goodbye Social Security, and goodbye America. Welcome to ObamaLand.
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No. of Recommendations: 3
just hope I am allowed to keep enough to live on for the duration of my life, but Obama and the Dems considered retired folk to be unworthy of consideration,

ResNullius


If I'm able to retire, as a retired conservative American of European descent I will be a member of a ethnic group considered lower than whale dung by the regime.

Soylent Green.

Mike
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No. of Recommendations: 2
Lock and load.
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No. of Recommendations: 11
The complete and utter hysteria over the "fiscal cliff" boggles me. It's like Y2K all over again. All kinds of crazy theories, and people thinking it's TEOTWAWKI.

Sure, there might be some economic impact from forced cuts and expiry of taxes if that even happens - which they will not let it do. But even then there won't be seizure of 401Ks or Roths or whatever people are theorizing about.

Me, I'm too busy with my real life to let myself get whipped up into hysteria by the media. If and when we cross the cliff I will react to whatever happens then. And I am betting it will be pretty much like Y2K.
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No. of Recommendations: 29
Sure, there might be some economic impact from forced cuts and expiry of taxes if that even happens - which they will not let it do. But even then there won't be seizure of 401Ks or Roths or whatever people are theorizing about.

I don't think you understand of the scope of the problem. How many trillions must the US be in debt ($16.3 actual, over $80T when you look at future unfunded liabilities) before you realize that THAT is the problem? The 'fiscal cliff' is a wart on the backside of the ogre that is about to turn around and smite us with his club. This whole 'tax the rich' meme is akin to dabbing Compound W on the ogre's wart. He's still there, even if you treat the wart.

Obama is once again talking about making sure that the rich don't get more than their share of the seats in the lifeboats after we hit the iceberg. Perhaps Captain Obama should actually think more about steering the boat. If we don't get entitlements on a sustainable path in the next four years, it will be one of the greatest failings of leadership in modern history, simply because it's staring us in the face. But watch Obama dodge it and blame the Republicans, and the media will think that's just fantastic.

There's one thing you can count on: no matter where Obama falls down with the football, the referees in the media will run over, draw and end zone around him and shout, "TOUCHDOWN!"
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No. of Recommendations: 1
If I'm able to retire, as a retired conservative American of European descent I will be a member of a ethnic group considered lower than whale dung by the regime.

Soylent Green.

Mike


I'm not sure exactly where you live in Pennsylvaniam but you may need to relocate to one of the red states Mike or at least to a rural area in Pen where you and like minded people band together for protection.

I'm currently rural enough, north of Dallas that I think I would be ok. But to be honest, I prefer further out amd will downsize and move when I retire within the next 7-9 years.

Call me a cynic...but I have no comfort that the growing minorities in America will show the same 'regard' to us as we have for them the past 50 years. Yes, I know before the 1960's, they were 2nd class citizens. But most of us were born during the 1950's or after and have no link to that oppression.

You and I know we will be punished for the sins of the past.

decath
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No. of Recommendations: 2
If that happens, it really is over for me. It will be like being a Jew in 1930's Europe. It's all over.

The question will be at the time, where could we run to? Canada, New Zealand, South America? Things like this make me fell less paranoid about buying gold coins.

That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.

For some reason a Patton quote comes to mind (to paraphrase)... You don't become a hero by dieing for your country. You become a hero by making the poor dumb bast*rd on the other side die for his country.

JLC
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The complete and utter hysteria over the "fiscal cliff" boggles me. It's like Y2K all over again. All kinds of crazy theories, and people thinking it's TEOTWAWKI.

I was watching CNBC this AM and of course they were talking fiscal cliff, even have a count down clock ticking away in the corner. Joe Kernen then asked, would it really be so bad to go over the cliff? Because with sequestration, the budget would become balanced and the deficit resolved.

What are we missing?

JLC
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What are we missing?

JLC


Probably not much. I think a recession in 2013 is a foregone conclusion, either way. The trillions on the sidelines before the election are pretty much going to stay there. Investments, investors, savers are all going to get punished. Obama did not hide his animosity toward those groups in the campaign, so why should he now?

Obama obviously has no intention of slowing the growth of debt; sequestration and fiscal cliff is better than what he offered yesterday. Both sides have to get more out of a fiscal cliff alternative in order to avoid it. Apparently, Dear Leader doesn't understand that.
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No. of Recommendations: 2
"I'm not sure exactly where you live in Pennsylvaniam but you may need to relocate to one of the red states Mike or at least to a rural area in Pen where you and like minded people band together for protection. I'm currently rural enough, north of Dallas that I think I would be ok. But to be honest, I prefer further out amd will downsize and move when I retire within the next 7-9 years.Call me a cynic...but I have no comfort that the growing minorities in America will show the same 'regard' to us as we have for them the past 50 years. Yes, I know before the 1960's, they were 2nd class citizens. But most of us were born during the 1950's or after and have no link to that oppression. You and I know we will be punished for the sins of the past." - decath

----------------------

I really liked living in a rural area when we lived back in East Tennessee. I miss our neighbors. It really is a community that watches out for one another. I miss it. Not to mention less traffic, easier and cheaper to renew license tags and driver's license, more trees and green open areas, streams and lakes and ponds, and animals.

Small town rural living is great. It really is. I loved it. I wish it was even more rural where live now than it is, and our neighbors have horses and goats in their back yard!

Art
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"The question will be at the time, where could we run to? Canada, New Zealand, South America? Things like this make me fell less paranoid about buying gold coins." - JLC


My neighbor across the street, Roy, retired former Navy Corpsman like Wolverine, told me he's made a lot of money investing in Gold. I think he's also invested in stuff like gold mining and also Gold coins. He's a hard core conservative Republican like a lot of ya'll.

He's also a huge University of Tennessee fan and has a big orange T on the side of his Van. We talk quite often standing in the middle of the street when we come out to get our mail. We live in a little heavily wooded cul-de-sac at the bottom of a hill with only 4 houses on it so we all know each other. It's very secluded.

Roy shoots squirrels in his yard with a 12 guage shotgun. I think he uses #4 shot? I bet it tears them all to pieces! <grin!> The other neighbor across the street from Roy shoots squirrels with a pellet rifle.

Art
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Probably not much. I think a recession in 2013 is a foregone conclusion, either way. The trillions on the sidelines before the election are pretty much going to stay there.
_______________________

Sadly, I doubt it

My guess is much like the Drilling rigs in the Gulf, they stay for a little while then move on to places where they can be more useful. Where they will be used to make other places more productive.

If they just sat there, that would be good, no other place would get more competitive, and the money would be there if we ever get sane.

That will not be the case.
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No. of Recommendations: 49
I have said many times, I see violence on the horizon.

The only people talking that way are you guys. You *are* the violence you see on the horizon. And why? Because you can't stop seeing boogey-men wherever you look. It doesn't matter that you keep being wrong about everything, every day you see a new boogey-man that makes you forget how wrong you were yesterday.

Please, put down the crack pipe before you hurt yourselves.
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No. of Recommendations: 10
Civil war will come if they try to take American's guns or 401k's.

If that happens, it really is over for me. It will be like being a Jew in 1930's Europe. It's all over.


I recced this post because it is so crazy, everyone should see it, sunlight being the best disinfectant and all...
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No. of Recommendations: 5
xLife
I recced this post because it is so crazy, everyone should see it, sunlight being the best disinfectant and all...


So if the gov't confiscated everyone's 401k's and nationalized it, redistributing the $ amongst everyone via a gov't pension, you don't see a problem with it?

I hope not. I see that as crazy. I'm not rich and only just last year for the 1st time crossed the 6 figure income threshold because my wife started working full time after many years of being a SAHM. I've been putting $ into my 401k/IRA's for 30 years since the age of 21.

Take that away from me and give it to shmucks that have been blowing their money away on afternoon cocktails, SUV's, McMansions and European vacations and yes...I will open up a can of whipa$$.

decath
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No. of Recommendations: 6
jwiest wrote: You *are* the violence you see on the horizon.

Really?

Obama pays my welfare check
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85hzg2SMF9U

Obama will pay my mortgage
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBtxFyIs_ck

My neighbor's food stamp day
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYeRJyiPAgk

Somebody owes me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3e41prVDv4

And my favorite...

Where's my food stamps?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufk7IXdxc-c

What do you think will happen when these "citizens" don't get fed?
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No. of Recommendations: 11
cc
What do you think will happen when these "citizens" don't get fed?


That's the sort of violence that is justified by liberals like jwiest. Remember the yawns the left and the media gave us during the OWS violence?

They were far more concerned with the non-existent violence that never happened from the tea-party.

Getty huffy about possible gov't confiscation of your assets after a lifetime of slow, steady accumulation....now that's a real problem for xLife and jwiest.

decath
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No. of Recommendations: 2
So if the gov't confiscated everyone's 401k's and nationalized it, redistributing the $ amongst everyone via a gov't pension, you don't see a problem with it?

Where in the world did you get that idea?

The choice isn't between "it'd be just like being a Jew in 1930's Europe" and "I have no problem with that."
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Man, these libs are thread killers, aren't they?
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Man, these libs are thread killers, aren't they?
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Is a thread killer anything like a moron? If so then yes.
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Man, these libs are thread killers, aren't they?

That is why God invented the Frowny Face. It radically improves the quality of your TMF experience.
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Man, these libs are thread killers, aren't they?

That is why God invented the Frowny Face. It radically improves the quality of your TMF experience.
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I need to see the world as it truly is, without blinders, to see the depths of depravity we've sunk to as a nation, it's tough, Facebook made it almost unbearable, but i'm determined. I will not shrink from this challenge <salute>!
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That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.

If you know who these people are who are planning revolt against the elected government are subversives and traitors to the constitution that they think they hold so dear.

If you know who they are, report them to the FBI!
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It's the Dems who are traitors to the Constitution.
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It's the Dems who are traitors to the Constitution.
You should see Lincoln.
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That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.

decath


Crazed man kills fifteen people on a shooting rampage.

Gets 20 recs from idiots on Retire Early Campfire.
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That's when I come to the admonition to "die with honor" and take down as many left-wing a-holes that I can with me.

decath

Crazed man kills fifteen people on a shooting rampage.
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Man you guys have gotten alot of mileage out of that quote. I've seen it everywhere. You guys have really played it into many recs. Good luck.
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Man you guys have gotten alot of mileage out of that quote.

That's because it's the sort of quote that needs to be ridiculed.
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No. of Recommendations: 10
Man you guys have gotten alot of mileage out of that quote.

That's because it's the sort of quote that needs to be ridiculed.
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Maybe you should change it a little, instead of the government confiscating your 401k and your guns like decath said, imagine their coming for your free contraceptives, then maybe you can relate.
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Gets 20 recs from idiots on Retire Early Campfire.

Some troll



Hey moron, by your reasoning you're here so you must be an idiot.

I wish TMF would get rid of the Best of Feature to keep trolls like the above off the board.
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Maybe you should change it a little, instead of the government confiscating your 401k and your guns like decath said, imagine their coming for your free contraceptives, then maybe you can relate.

Nobody's coming for my (or your) guns. Obama has said absolutely nothing that lends any support to the idea that he's coming after guns. What's funny, however, is that this absolute silence is interpreted by the NRA and the right as proof that he's planning to take away our guns.

An argument from silence, I suppose......

And so far, except for some blather, nobody's coming for my (or your) IRAs, 401ks or 403bs)

That would never fly.


The only place where either of these ideas is alive and well... is in the fervid imaginations of bunker dwelling righties who are convinced that Obama is a communist, and that a race war is imminent.

I would love to count the number of times that the same video clips are recycled by righties..... Obamaphone.... Obama gonna give me free money.... etc.. etc.. ad nauseum

They're working themselves into a real snit over it all.
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I'm not sure exactly where you live in Pennsylvania but you may need to relocate to one of the red states Mike or at least to a rural area in Pen where you and like minded people band together for protection.

decath


I'm in SW PA and I'm 5 miles north of the start of a red area. Only my county, Allegheny, went for Obama in November. The surrounding countys are rural and coal country and all went for Romney.

Mike
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Bite me, idiot.



If I could rec it multiple times I'd do so just to pizz off a creep like you.
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wzabom wrote: Nobody's coming for my (or your) guns. Obama has said absolutely nothing that lends any support to the idea that he's coming after guns.

No, no, no...it's not government coming after one's guns. It's the entitlement crowd coming after your possessions that you must then defend with guns that's the issue. It's a-coming.
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Bite me, idiot.

Bill c'mon, don't go down this road. You're better than this
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Nobody's coming for my (or your) guns. Obama has said absolutely nothing that lends any support to the idea that he's coming after guns. What's funny, however, is that this absolute silence is interpreted by the NRA and the right as proof that he's planning to take away our guns.
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He said if they come for his 401K and guns. And you might be right about them not coming for 401k's "because it would never fly", but that's the only reason they wouldn't do it, but they are already calling contributions a subsidy, so if there's a way to carve out a constituency to save the benefit for, like the "middle class" and play the middle class and the people without 401k's against, "the rich", i could totally see them ending tax free contributions for them and then working from there. I wouldn't underestimate the liberal mindset that sees all money as the governments money and what you keep as a sort of gift, that's why they say things like "subsidy" and "revenue enhansements", they don't see it as your money, they see it as money they've let you keep because they've been nice, but now they're spending 25% of GDP and, well, you know, times are tight for free spending Sammy.

As for guns, after Fast & Furious i would not underestimate the governments desire to clamp down on guns.
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wolverine.... thanks for the reminder, as well as the challenge.

I apologize.
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is in the fervid imaginations of bunker dwelling righties who are convinced that Obama is a communist

Bill, only one willfully ignorant of the faacts would say this.

WHo is Valerie Jarret's FIL?

Who is Frank Davis?

The list goes on. My mother had a saying "Show me who your friends are and I'll tell you who you are." If the neighbor kid was chumming with the local hoodlums, what would you assume about him?

It couldn't be more obvious, but no amount of information will convince you if you choose to ignore the obvious.
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Crazed man kills fifteen people on a shooting rampage.

Gets 20 recs from idiots on Retire Early Campfire.


Crazed liberals abort millions of babies. Liberals cheer.

Save me your phony outrage.
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wolverine.... thanks for the reminder, as well as the challenge.

I apologize.


Bill, it is no secret that I have 95% of TMF libs filtered. I do have exceptions: you, Peter Rabit, dovbaer, and a few others. As a rule, you are able to make your point without getting hostile. That is why I don't filter you. You have proven to be able to disagree without being disagreeable.

I get why you would feel insulted, but escalating things is seldom helpful. That is why I use the Frowny Face, to keep things from getting too heated.

I acknowledge that I don't always practice what I preach, but I guess that is what makes us human.
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You're better than this

wolverine


Really? This cretin, whose posts I've never read prior to this thread, barges in here and calls us all idiots. He's better than that? You must be kidding.

Mike
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Really? This cretin, whose posts I've never read prior to this thread, barges in here and calls us all idiots. He's better than that? You must be kidding.

I have a history with Bill. We've had discussion in the past. Believe it or not, he's actually a good person.
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Nobody's coming for my (or your) guns. Obama has said absolutely nothing that lends any support to the idea that he's coming after guns.
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"The government is not looking to take over healthcare, you guys are just in your right wing bunkers with fervent imaginations"

"The government isn't really taking over healthcare with Obamacare, they're just making it better and regning in the health insurers who've run roughshod over poor people"

<Hi, i'm the designer of Obamacare, it's not a trojan horse, it's right there in the open>

<Hi, i'm Jan Schakowsky speaking to a bunch of liberals, my goal is socialised medicine, and we'll get there>

<Hi, i'm Barney Frank heading for an elevator being questioned, i'm totally for socialised healthcare>

<Hi i'm socialist Bernie Sanders, well, you know>

"The government should control the healthcare industry".
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I know the game, pretend it's just crazy talk, and then slowly as it happens say it's a good thing, because, d'uh, you think it's a good thing. It'd be nice if some of you nanny lovin' freaks would admit it.
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I know the game, pretend it's just crazy talk, and then slowly as it happens say it's a good thing, because, d'uh, you think it's a good thing. It'd be nice if some of you nanny lovin' freaks would admit it.

Don't forget the money quote from John Dingell (D-MI)

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/03/24/dingell-it-will-take-a...

This is why I don't debate libs. They live in a dream world and can't wait for the masters to slap the chains around their ankles.
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Let me remind you this has been going on for years. We are bringing it to a halt. The harsh fact of the matter is when you’re going to pass legislation that will cover 300 American people in different ways it takes a long time to do the necessary administrative steps that have to be taken to put the legislation together to control the people.
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Exactly, and unrelated to healthcare remember Maxine Waters taking to Oil Companies telling them she wanted to nationalize them.
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Bite me, idiot.


Bill c'mon, don't go down this road. You're better than this
___________________

You're one of my faves dude, so it pains me to say this

You lie
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I have a history with Bill. We've had discussion in the past. Believe it or not, he's actually a good person.
______________________________________

Yes he is, however he has also been calling all who dare dissgree with Obama racists and worse for a long time now

What he is out here, and that he is a better person than that, simply your statement that he is better than this is not true

He was the last straw for me personally. I shared your opinion. He alone made me believe there are no good liberals when it comes to their willingness to exert control over others, that there are no bounds and that to not show them the respect they are due is a mistake
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"Bill, it is no secret that I have 95% of TMF libs filtered. I do have exceptions: you, Peter Rabit, dovbaer, and a few others. As a rule, you are able to make your point without getting hostile. That is why I don't filter you. You have proven to be able to disagree without being disagreeable.

I get why you would feel insulted, but escalating things is seldom helpful. That is why I use the Frowny Face, to keep things from getting too heated." - wolverine

----------------


I do the same thing on the Near-death.com message board. I make the posters that only come there to argue and be disagreeable disappear. In fact I don't give them a second chance. The first post that starts arguing with something I said I say "BYE BYE!"
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I do the same thing on the Near-death.com message board. I make the posters that only come there to argue and be disagreeable disappear. In fact I don't give them a second chance. The first post that starts arguing with something I said I say "BYE BYE!"
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Is there a duality board you make poster disappear on? That would be kind of ironic.
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Is there a duality board you make poster disappear on? That would be kind of ironic.
___________________________

Think separation!
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I have said many times, I see violence on the horizon.

The only people talking that way are you guys. You *are* the violence you see on the horizon. And why? Because you can't stop seeing boogey-men wherever you look. It doesn't matter that you keep being wrong about everything, every day you see a new boogey-man that makes you forget how wrong you were yesterday.

Please, put down the crack pipe before you hurt yourselves.
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This in todays news:

This one came out of the blue, considering I didn’t even know anyone was still looking for them. Up on the Canadian border, the FBI has arrested somebody who has been on their radar for a very long time. Rebecca Jeanette Rubin was a high profile member of the ecoterrorist group ELF (the Earth Liberation Front) and has been on the run for quite some time. It appears that run has come to an end.

A Canadian woman who has been an international fugitive from charges relating to a string of fires set by environmental radicals surrendered to U.S. authorities on Thursday, officials said.

After a decade on the run, Rebecca Jeanette Rubin, 39, turned herself in at the Canadian border in Blaine, Wash., the FBI announced. She faces federal arson and conspiracy charges in Oregon, Colorado and California. After an appearance in federal district court in Seattle, she will be sent to face trial in Oregon, officials said.

Rubin is accused of being part of a cell known as the Family, which was based in Eugene, Ore., and was affiliated with the Earth Liberation Front and the Animal Liberation Front. From 1996 to 2001, the group was responsible for 20 arsons in five Western states, officials said.


“The Family” was under the direction of William C. Rodgers of Arizona, who was arrested in 2005. He committed suicide. Most of this took place quite a while ago, but among the many infamous cases of arson they perpetrated, one of the most violent, spectacular and expensive was the burning of a 206-unit condominium which was under construction near San Diego, California in 2003. Fortunately, nobody was killed in the massive blaze, but it caused approximately $20M dollars in damage, including a $7M construction crane and the explosion of a 500 gallon fuel tank. When it was all over, the following charming message was left in the rubble.
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Very lucky no one was killed, and this was to protest "urban sprawl" (talk about loons), you think violence isn't possible out of these types of people? The reason i see violence is because at the rate we are going there will not be enough money to prop up all the social programs when the debt becomes unsustainable and the safety net programs and other things will get cut, and when they get cut people that've come to depend on them for generations in some cases won't like it, and when they don't like it things like what is happening in Greece will start happening, it's not quantum physics. I'm not saying it'll happen tomorrow, but if things don't get turned around quickly it will happen. And before it happens you can bet your sweet bippy they will float trial balloons about 401k assets because they'll be desperate for money, like they were in Argentina. It won't take much, just some interest rate changes that make the interest on the debt balloon to swamp all the tax reciepts coming in. You can talk about crack pipes all you want, but the dems are completely unserious, and it will happen if they get their way.
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Somebody: The only people talking that way are you guys. You *are* the violence you see on the horizon. And why? Because you can't stop seeing boogey-men wherever you look. It doesn't matter that you keep being wrong about everything, every day you see a new boogey-man that makes you forget how wrong you were yesterday.

How many links do you want me to provide about liberal violence? I sure hope you remove your head from your backside before driving.
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You're one of my faves dude, so it pains me to say this

You lie


LOL!!!
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Yes he is, however he has also been calling all who dare dissgree with Obama racists and worse for a long time now

He is a liberal, hence unable to comprehend things that differ from his dogma. It is useless to try and explain that my dislike for Obama is based upon his values and actions. It just doesn't compute.

He was the last straw for me personally. I shared your opinion. He alone made me believe there are no good liberals when it comes to their willingness to exert control over others, that there are no bounds and that to not show them the respect they are due is a mistake

I cut Bill some slack. He works with those in recovery. I know that he is working his 12th Step, but as someone who has worked with alcoholics I understand how difficult it is and appreciate his efforts. It allows me to overlook some things in him that I would not in others.
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I cut Bill some slack. He works with those in recovery. I know that he is working his 12th Step, but as someone who has worked with alcoholics I understand how difficult it is and appreciate his efforts. It allows me to overlook some things in him that I would not in others.
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I think liberals should keep drinking, it can't hurt. What's the worst that could happen? He's already liberal.
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wzabom wrote: Nobody's coming for my (or your) guns. Obama has said absolutely nothing that lends any support to the idea that he's coming after guns.

No, no, no...it's not government coming after one's guns. It's the entitlement crowd coming after your possessions that you must then defend with guns that's the issue. It's a-coming.


And anyone who doesn't think Obama has said anything which lends any support to the idea that he wants to come after our guns, obviously doesn't know what Obama has said.

Or maybe backing a UN resolution that effectively prohibits private ownership of firearms, doesn't actually mean he wants to take away the firearms that people currently legally own.
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Somebody: The only people talking that way are you guys. You *are* the violence you see on the horizon. And why? Because you can't stop seeing boogey-men wherever you look. It doesn't matter that you keep being wrong about everything, every day you see a new boogey-man that makes you forget how wrong you were yesterday.

How many links do you want me to provide about liberal violence? I sure hope you remove your head from your backside before driving.


One statement from one conservative that under certain restricted and defined circumstances he might turn to violence, is sufficient to prove that all conservatives have no answer to anything except racist violence.

A million documented instances of liberals being arrested for violence, with half of them being explicitly racial, would be isolated incidents and mean nothing.
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One statement from one conservative that under certain restricted and defined circumstances he might turn to violence, is sufficient to prove that all conservatives have no answer to anything except racist violence.

A million documented instances of liberals being arrested for violence, with half of them being explicitly racial, would be isolated incidents and mean nothing.
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Exactly, nailed it. I'm out of recs so i'm giving you a "heh, heh" instead.
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Exactly, nailed it. I'm out of recs so i'm giving you a "heh, heh" instead.

Don't worry; I hooked him up.
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"Or maybe backing a UN resolution that effectively prohibits private ownership of firearms, doesn't actually mean he wants to take away the firearms that people currently legally own"


Heh heh


First he gets the US to approve the UN resolution....(first getting it passed in the UN)......

then...he is 'forced' to implement the UN resolution banning firearms possession.

He had no choice.

HE'll never be 'responsbile' for it....but he just 'had to comply' with the international community.

Just like he'll sell us down the river for carbon taxes. 20 trillion in carbon taxes, 99% of it going outside the country for 'redistribution'. Remember, he told us 'the US has too much'. Uses 'too much oil' - more than it's 'fair share'.


It will start with banning bullets.....no bullets.....guns become useless after a while. Then they go after 'gun stores' .and 'gun shows'.......no place to buy a gun, no new guns.....and it 10 years....it starts to wind down. Then they decide that you must 'sell' the government your gun....you got a year to turn all of them in. Then it becomes illegal to own them.

Of course, if there is a 'crisis' - like a pre arranged riot in say, Watts or Chicago....then you instantly accelerate all of these in the name of 'public welfare'.... and your guns are gone in six months...,



t.
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Of course, they never consider the downside.

The country is suffering from a lack of capital investment.

The fed has kept interest rates at zero, so people move their money into the stock market to feed the capital markets. They are desperate to 'stimulate' the economy, and forcing folks seeking yield into the stock market and 'investing' does that....with, naturally, more risk than holding treasury notes.


They are counting on a study done in Denmark that showed people 'saved' the same whether there were tax deferred accounts of not.

So if they eliminate or reduce the tax deferment for 401K/IRA..which is something like 180 billion a year in 'lost taxes' ...taxes they don't get THIS year...... then they'll get that tax money...

and they'll hope the remainder STILL gets invested in capital markets.

That's a big IF, and of course, 20 or 28 or 38% of the money went to Uncle Sam to waste, and not into investments.


They could be shooting themselves in the foot.

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BTW - I think we are going right over the fiscal cliff. No way that Obama will propose any spending cuts NOW....just a promise to cut 'in the future' and he'll never do it, just like the last deal where he reneged on cutting spending.

Over the cliff. He won't bend. Neither will the republicans. Obama won't cut any taxes NOW..but wants the taxes NO.....




t.
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Yes he is, however he has also been calling all who dare dissgree with Obama racists and worse for a long time now

I have never called anyone a racist for disagreeing with Obama.

I have, however, called particular comments "racist".
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"Is there a duality board you make poster disappear on? That would be kind of ironic." - 2828


It's amazing to me how great the internet has turned out to be in causing duality and separation. It's like some people troll message boards for the sole purpose of arguing and disagreeing with people. I swear some folks would argue with a circlular saw if you gave them half a chance.

Art
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"Think separation!" - lowstudent


That's what the little frowny face is for. It works real good.

Art
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I swear some folks would argue with a circlular saw if you gave them half a chance.

Would not <g>.
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I swear some folks would argue with a circlular saw if you gave them half a chance.

Would not <g>.


Well, with a circular saw, you start with one piece of wood, and then you get...

...

Wood two
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Cut it twice and it's still too short?
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I swear some folks would argue with a circlular saw if you gave them half a chance.

Would not <g>.


Well, with a circular saw, you start with one piece of wood, and then you get...

...

Wood two



That was simply awful...




...but I gave it a Rec. :-)
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How many links do you want me to provide about liberal violence? I sure hope you remove your head from your backside before driving.

__________________

It is key to consider that liberals redefines situations to fit a reality that is anything but realistic.

It is important to remember, liberals see the person who buys a burglar alarm as a thief.

Why do I say that?

They believe that folks buying weapons to protect themselves and who want to secede from a place they believe is about to become violent as folks who desire violence.
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They are counting on a study done in Denmark that showed people 'saved' the same whether there were tax deferred accounts of not.
_____________________________

You think so?

I would guess were you adventurous enough to enter the cavernous empty space where liberal thought is supposed to occur, that you would find a different mindset altogether.

One where the money rather than being saved and invested follows what to a liberal is a more efficient and logical path

The money is taxed, and that money is then distributed to only the best projects and those that will yield the best return.

The privately saved money would go to projects that competed with each other, and did things like advertise things with no benefit. by taking it in taxes instead? It goes to a single source no competition all research aimed at the most efficient ideas only. No need to waste time advertising as there is only one perfect product. No need for pet rocks, all the money goes to impeccable and functional grey suits and caps and ...

This IS what they believe. If you assume government does not make mistakes, what could go wrong?
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"Think separation!" - lowstudent


That's what the little frowny face is for. It works real good.

Art
______________________

Art, why take a little playful teasing so seriously?
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One statement from one conservative that under certain restricted and defined circumstances he might turn to violence, is sufficient to prove that all conservatives have no answer to anything except racist violence.

LOL, one statement, rec'd by many. It's how you talk, and you encourage each other to talk that way. 2nd ammendment solutions, unitarian church shootings...all the violence is on your end.

A million documented instances of liberals being arrested for violence, with half of them being explicitly racial, would be isolated incidents and mean nothing.

Except these are as fictional as "voter fraud". All you have are 3 Black Panthers and some idiots at ELF. "A million"? This is the heart of your delusion. Like I said, you can't stop seeing boogey-men wherever you look, and you seem to take a sick perverse pleasure in inflating their size and strength. I guess it's the only way you can rationalize keeping the opinions you do.
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"Art, why take a little playful teasing so seriously?" - lowstudent


I take very little in life seriously. I'm just along for the ride.

My reply wasn't meant seriously, but seriously if someone irritates you there is always the option of putting them in your P-Box. I don't have a whole lot of people in there but some folks I just need a respite from them every now and then.

Art
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wolve
How many links do you want me to provide about liberal violence? I sure hope you remove your head from your backside before driving.



Hee hee hee. My comments sure did rile up the PA drive by's.

Well, I meant what I said and I'll say it again if I have to.

What the PA libs miss is that all of us with our guns and 401ks and uh... balls...which apparently liberals don't have.. is that that we are talking about defending ourselves..not going on the attack.

I find it comical. Nothing riles up a pink pantied liberal metrosexual more that calmly stating...."I will defend myself and shoot anybody that comes after me and my family".

decath
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Wzambon
Crazed man kills fifteen people on a shooting rampage.

Gets 20 recs from idiots on Retire Early Campfire.



I take offense at that.

Only 15? Unless you mean 15 after I've run out of bullets...then I can see that.

We ARE talking about me against liberals anyhoo. <g>

decath
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