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http://www.evolutionnews.org/2008/04/what_about_evolution_is_random.html

Here's another one for my "you can't make this stuff up" file. I kid you not, this is a news story about a new peer-reviewed paper in PLoS Biology by Brian Paegel and Gerald Joyce of The Scripps Research Institute which explains that (all emphasis from here on is mine)

they have produced a computer-controlled system that can drive the evolution of improved RNA enzymes.

I couldn't write a funnier script if I tried. Sadly, these guys just don't get the joke.

The evolution of molecules via scientific experiment is not new. The first RNA enzymes to be “evolved” in the lab were generated in the 1990s. But what is exciting about this work is that the process has been made automatic. Thus evolution is directed by a machine without requiring human intervention-other then providing the initial ingredients and switching the machine on.

But wait it gets better.

Throughout the process, the evolution-machine can propagate the reaction itself, because whenever the enzyme population size reaches a predetermined level, the machine removes a fraction of the population and replaces the starting chemicals needed for the reaction to continue.

What? Predetermined? Predetermined by whom or by what? Oh, the evolution machine, which itself is a result of intelligent agency.
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I couldn't write a funnier script if I tried. Sadly, these guys just don't get the joke...What? Predetermined? Predetermined by whom or by what? Oh, the evolution machine, which itself is a result of intelligent agency.

I don't get it.

What the Paegel and Joyce experiment demonstrates is that if one has the appropriate INITIAL conditions and adds random mutations, one can get evolution of new complex structures without any further intervention.

Why is that considered a joke?
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Why is that considered a joke?

Any man made experiment that produces results that support evolution really just prove ID because an intelligent agent sent the whole thing into motion.
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Any man made experiment that produces results that support evolution really just prove ID because an intelligent agent sent the whole thing into motion.

Yeah, like the apocryphal story of Galileo dropping weights off the Tower of Pisa was just an example of Intelligent Falling.
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Why is that considered a joke?
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Any man made experiment that produces results that support evolution really just prove ID because an intelligent agent sent the whole thing into motion.



that's how i read the OP



=
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Any man made experiment that produces results that support evolution really just prove ID because an intelligent agent sent the whole thing into motion.

In other words, to a creationist it is logically impossible to perform an experiment that supports the existence of any natural process.

That will probably require more than a few shots of Jack Daniels to be convincing.
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In other words, to a creationist it is logically impossible to perform an experiment that supports the existence of any natural process.

Now you're getting it!

* If no experiment supports evolution, then it proves that creationism is true by default.
* If some experiment supports evolution, then that experiment was done by humans, who have intelligence, and therefore it proves that creationism is true.

It's really simple once you accept it.
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If some experiment supports evolution, then that experiment was done by humans, who have intelligence, and therefore it proves that creationism is true.

So the only way to empirically test the validity of evolution is through experiments designed without intelligence.

Now I understand the purpose of the Discovery Institute.
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So the only way to empirically test the validity of evolution is through experiments designed without intelligence.

And since thats been going on for billions of years, but can't be observed for billions of years to verify, evolution cannot be proven.

Now I understand the purpose of the Discovery Institute.

Besides the barb you tossed, it also packages an easy to digest wedgie for the masses.
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And since thats been going on for billions of years, but can't be observed for billions of years to verify, evolution cannot be proven.

There is such a thing as the preponderance of the evidence. If evolution is correct in general then there should be predictable consequences. One can test to see whether those predictions can be confirmed. So far, they have been.
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There is such a thing as the preponderance of the evidence.

Not with the DI nor AiG. That "preponderance" is all part of a conspiracy of science against Jesus. It's MUS.

If evolution is correct in general then there should be predictable consequences. One can test to see whether those predictions can be confirmed. So far, they have been.

Again...you forget the crowd we're discussing...all the evidence clearly shows that evolution is wrong, that the Earth is only 6K years old, and the first cowboys rode dinosaurs.

1poorguy (not to mention that all experiments prove ID, as another poster pointed out)
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There is such a thing as the preponderance of the evidence. If evolution is correct in general then there should be predictable consequences. One can test to see whether those predictions can be confirmed. So far, they have been.

From a reasonable perspective, yes, but we are dealing with faith, a school of thought that can apply reason at its discretion and whim.

My favorite religious concept of all time is damnation and salvation. Can't ever be proved or disproved, but what a great cattle prod it is.
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Any man made experiment that produces results that support evolution really just prove ID because an intelligent agent sent the whole thing into motion.

This is the dumbest thing I have ever read in my entire life.

JB
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This is the dumbest thing I have ever read in my entire life.

JB


Welcome to C v E where we offer periodic lessons in just how silly things can get.

One cannot defeat a wall if one does not understand the wall one is trying to beat.*

Nigel

* From Son Zu's The Art of Stupid
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