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http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2008/12/13/us/AP-Palin-Churc...

ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.

Whether the arson was sanctioned by the Democratic Party or was the work of a splinter group acting independently remains unclear for the time being.

Congressional Democratic leaders have not taken credit for the act of terrorism, but have not denied involvement either.

President-elect Barack Obama had no comment on the incident.
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Rahm Emanuel has been conspicuously missing from Obama messiah-elect news conferences lately. Just sayin'.

2828
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Rahm Emanuel has been conspicuously missing from Obama messiah-elect news conferences lately. Just sayin'.

Is there any room under the bus(es)?
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Rahm Emanuel has been conspicuously missing from Obama messiah-elect news conferences lately. Just sayin'.

2828

I suspect he's too busy dredging up hush money and twisting arms.

LD
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Just in case it's successful, I'm the one who FA'd it. You do not label your satire as an AP story, IMO.

Pity, because it was pretty good as an Onion piece.

Phil
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Like anyone in their right mind would believe an AP story was hard on democrats in any way, i mean lets get real here <g>.

2828
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ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.

Whether the arson was sanctioned by the Democratic Party or was the work of a splinter group acting independently remains unclear for the time being.

Congressional Democratic leaders have not taken credit for the act of terrorism, but have not denied involvement either.

President-elect Barack Obama had no comment on the incident.

alchook


Sounds like the evil Karl Rove was involved. He will soon be out of job. Torching Palin's church so the Dems get the blame. Can't trust that guy. <g> Hard to put out a fire in -20F weather.

Mike
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spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.

Where's the proof that it was Democrats who did it?

Yeah, outside of your warped mind, no where.
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Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.

Alchook,

Your satire is rather incindiary.

You're just throwing fuel on the fire of partisan rants.
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ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.


Dare we hope that she was in it?
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ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.


Dare we hope that she was in it?

ROTJob

"The Fool: Describe the most embarrassing personal moment you'll admit to!
ROTJob: I was a Young Republican in college.

.
.
.

The Fool: What's been your best investment to date, and how did you discover it?
ROTJob: Free thought. It popped into my head after watching FoxNews for most of the day. I saw the propaganda machine for exactly what it was and vowed to never be ignorant again."


Here I thought you leftist DRWs were kinder and gentler than us mean old conservatives. Guess in your case, I was wrong.

Mike
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ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.


Dare we hope that she was in it?


Wow Rotjob, if that's the kind of thing you say around your kids, I don't want them around mine. What an attitude.

IP,
who can't imagine wishing harm on her worst enemy like that
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>> Dare we hope that she was in it? <<

Regardless of what one thinks of someone's politics and personality, that's just plain ugly and despicable. Just what I'd expect from the hypocrite wing of the "tolerance" ideology.

Anyone who wishes real physical harm and suffering on a political opponent because of their politics -- above and beyond political defeat -- is a rather pathetic creature.

#29
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Anyone who wishes real physical harm and suffering on a political opponent because of their politics -- above and beyond political defeat -- is a rather pathetic creature.

Ditto. Sorry to have to say it, but ditto for anyone who finds amusement in a church torching. In the interest of full disclosure, said topic hits especially close to home for me: http://www.gracecathedraltopeka.org/tour_fire.htm

It was almost 30 years before the last window was replaced, and the frescos and intricate carvings that were there before the fire will never be back.

Phil
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Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.

It's the first step as we turn away from the War on Terror and towards the War on Christmas.

-synchronicity
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ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.


Dare we hope that she was in it?
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Not her, but two kids, that's pretty good. Still no word on where Rahm Emanuel was.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D953B2UG0&show_a...

ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) - Federal investigators in Alaska say an accelerant was poured around the exterior of Gov. Sarah Palin's home church before it was heavily damaged by a fire.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives said Monday that the accelerant was poured at several locations around the church, including entrances.

Federal Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms Special Agent Nick Starcevic says laboratory tests will determine what the accelerant was.

The blaze was set at the main entrance of the Wasilla Bible Church on Friday evening while a small group, including two children, were inside. No one was injured.
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Dare we hope that she was in it?

Whoa. She may be a lying hypocrite, but that was uncalled for.
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Federal Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms Special Agent Nick Starcevic says laboratory tests will determine what the accelerant was.

Will the church have to pay for the laboratory tests or are those type of tests free in Palin's universe?
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Bozo that is a standard thing done in a crime investigation as part of city/count obligations.

Go elsewhere for your attempt at a political jab.
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Just in case it's successful, I'm the one who FA'd it. You do not label your satire as an AP story, IMO.

Pity, because it was pretty good as an Onion piece.

Phil


Thanks.

So far it appears to have survived the FA.

I think the standard at work here is whether a reasonable person would read the post and assume it to be facetious. If so, it falls under the fair use standard.

I trust the powers that be saw it as an attempt to parody our current state of political discourse, in which both sides are all too willing to assume the absolute worst about each other, rather than an actual work of deception.

Or else they just haven't gotten around to pulling it.
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http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2008/12/13/us/AP-Palin-Churc......

ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday.


That's not what article you linked says. It says:

[Central Mat-Su Fire Chief James Steele]said the blaze was being investigated as an arson but didn't know of any recent threats to the church. Authorities didn't know whether Palin's connection to the church was relevant to the fire, Steele said.

''It's hard to say at this point. Everything is just speculation,'' he said. ''We have no information on intent or motive.''


The only hit on Google for "Apparently not content with victory in the recent Presidential election, spiteful Democrats burned Alaska Governor Sarah Palin’s church to the ground yesterday" is your TMF post. Did you make this up? Pretty dishonest, I'd say.
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Anyone who wishes real physical harm and suffering on a political opponent because of their politics -- above and beyond political defeat -- is a rather pathetic creature.


Why bring Ann Coulter into this?
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I think the standard at work here is whether a reasonable person would read the post and assume it to be facetious. If so, it falls under the fair use standard.

The fair use standard has to do with copyright law. What you are doing isn't violating copyright, it's pretending that your words are the AP's words. You may be of the group which dismisses automatically anything from the MSM, but there are still a great many people who don't.

I listen to a lot of C-SPAN, which means I'm exposed to the voice of the people a lot. It's scary what they're willing to believe.

My all time favorite was the pretty good joke about then President Clinton appearing at a press conference with a pair of pink panties pinned to his jacket. When questioned, he said, "It's the patch. I'm trying to quit."

About a month after that made the rounds a woman called in to C-SPAN to express her outrage. I don't know how they do it, but usually C-SPAN hosts keep a straight face and "Thanks for your call," but in this case the host said, "You realize it's a joke, right?" "Oh, no, it's true. I read it on the Internet."

Phil
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Did you make this up? Pretty dishonest, I'd say.

Maybe it was a typo.

I think I deserve the benefit of the doubt.
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What you are doing isn't violating copyright, it's pretending that your words are the AP's words.

If I'm not violating copyright law I should be OK.

It would only be illegal to spoof AP if “AP” stood for “Allah’s Prophet,” in which case the Secretary of Faith would be required to issue a fatwa on me.
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...the accelerant was poured at several locations around the church, including entrances.

Just to point out, this was intended to trap anyone inside. Whenever they catch this bastard they need to be charged with attempted murder.

JLC
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Not cool. Shoddy citation, and not really funny either. The way to do it would be to cite the story as is from AP and then make YOUR comments below it. By starting it with the AP dateline and then riffing on it, one can't tell how much is made up - how much is you and how much AP.

The one and only time I've FA'd anyone is when they quoted one of my posts, added a bunch of reprehensible stuff about Nazis as their response, but all muddled up with my own words and formatted as a quote - making it sound like I said those things.

I'm not FA'ing this, as - well - you aren't mangling my words but someone else's. But If I were with the AP, I'd sure have issues with it.
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>> Not cool. Shoddy citation, and not really funny either. <<

Perhaps. But not as uncool and unfunny as someone wishing she were in the church when it was burning.

#29
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The fair use standard has to do with copyright law. What you are doing isn't violating copyright, it's pretending that your words are the AP's words.


Alchook stole the joke from me, and I stole it from some TV comedy skit from 20 years ago (possibly SNL), called "Writer's Embellishment." Some news guy was reading the news, while occasionally inserting all sorts of outrageous exaggerations. During the "outrageous" moments, the words "writer's embellishment" would flash on the screen. Then they'd disappear when he'd get back to reality.

I've made a few posts like that at TMF over the years--adding obviously fake material to a quoted news story*--and being the influencial and well-liked poster that I am, it's only natural that alchook would steal my stolen material. So actually, it's SNL who deserves the apology. Or it might have been that old defunct show 'Fridays'. Or maybe NNTN. I can't remember.




* For example, http://boards.fool.com/Message.asp?mid=25123283
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Perhaps. But not as uncool and unfunny as someone wishing she were in the church when it was burning.
Yeah, well there's sloppy (as this is), and just plain reprehensible (as the other is).

I honestly thought this whole thing was fake for several days because of the way it was presented here. Citations should not be screwed with.
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I'm no fan of Sarah Palin, but that's just a wrong attitude.
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Just to point out, this was intended to trap anyone inside. Whenever they catch this bastard they need to be charged with attempted murder.
- JLC

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then quickly separate his head from his body. They need to bring back the guillotine. Seriously. I think it's probably pretty fast and humane. I'd even let some prisoners decide whether they would prefer to be locked up the rest of their lives or go ahead and be beheaded. If it were up to me I'd empty out the prisons.

Art
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Not cool. Shoddy citation, and not really funny either. The way to do it would be to cite the story as is from AP and then make YOUR comments below it. By starting it with the AP dateline and then riffing on it, one can't tell how much is made up - how much is you and how much AP.

That reminds me of an old joke.

“How many Gingkos does it take to change a light bulb?”

“I don’t think that’s a bit funny.”
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You really created alot of duality with that one.

2828
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I've made a few posts like that at TMF over the years--adding obviously fake material to a quoted news story*--and being the influential and well-liked poster that I am, it's only natural that alchook would steal my stolen material.

Person who uses cat reference in screen name even while claiming to be a man:

Until you mentioned these posts I had assumed I was, indeed, well versed in your vast body of work.

Now that I realize the existence of your writings heretofore unknown to me I again have the strength to go on living.
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Citations should not be screwed with.

Luckily for me the sun did rise the next morning.
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"You really created alot of duality with that one." - 2828


The question is, do you think it will lead to someone experiencing separation?

Art
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The question is, do you think it will lead to someone experiencing separation?
______________________

Art, we don't have to create we will all experience it whether we create it or not.

If you need any other clarifications let me know<grin>
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You really created alot of duality with that one.

2828


I FA'd your post.

Let's just say that duality is not a laughing matter.

alchook
not sure what duality is
deeply offended never the less
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Art, we don't have to create we will all experience it whether we create it or not.

If you need any other clarifications let me know<grin> - lowstudent

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


"By George I think he's got it!"

- Arthur
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Let's just say that duality is not a laughing matter.

alchook
not sure what duality is
deeply offended never the less

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Duality is something you experience every single day, whether you want to or not. It's also something you experience on this board everytime you or someone else argues over some innane matter.

Duality means stuff like different religions, different politics, different cultures, different races, different languages, ... dialects, color, gender, sexual orientation, wealth, I.Q., education, socio-economic status, looks, fame, ... all the crap in life that separates us.

I believe it exists for the sole reason for the soul to experience duality and separation. Why? So the soul can learn what it means and how it feels to be separate. Why? Because there is no separation in Heaven and it may be impossible to become a separate, unique, individual in heaven due to those overwhelming feelings of oneness and connectedness that so many near death experiencers say they experienced while on the other side. I don't think it's possible to develop a sense of "self" in heaven, it has to be done here where there is a plethora of "duality."

The soul's lessons are embedded in our everyday lives and it learns holistically what it's supposed to learn. It doesn't matter what we believe nor what side we take, all that matters is that we experience that sense of separation so the soul can learn what it means to be separate.

I could post hundreds of quotes about people who felt a sense of "oneness" in heaven, but I'll limit myself to just one so you get the idea.

"I suddenly just relaxed completely and allowed "myself" to dissolve (?) open up (?) merge (?) into the "oneness" that surrounded me." - excerpt from Mark Horton's NDE, http://www.mindspring.com/~scottr/nde/markh.html

Art
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Duality is something you experience every single day, whether you want to or not.


Ah!

So it's like an erection.
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"You really created alot of duality with that one." - 2828


The question is, do you think it will lead to someone experiencing separation?

Art
---------------------------------------------------------------
My guess is if they catch the arsonist he/she will be hailed as a hero and run in the next election for president as a democrat, with the shoe thrower as his/her vice presidential pick. They'd be a, er, shoe in to win, get it, shoe in, ok i'm done.

2828
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So it's like an erection.

_________________________

Seems like a decent analogy to me. Life is hard, but after dealing with a tumultuos time, and some seperation everything is all relaxing and fine
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Ah!

So it's like an erection. - alchook

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


In the sense that you experience it and not everybody else does. It's yours and it belongs to you. It's something you can relate to but not every other person on this planet can understand what it means. Not everyone has erections so in that sense, yes, an erection could be thought of as a sort of "duality."

Erections are also age dependent. When we are young they seem such a large part of us and demand so much of us but as I've grown older it's not so insistent, not so demanding, and more controllable. Even though I still have them it's not something that happens as spontaneously and it doesn't take over my whole being like it did when I was young.

The difference between generations is a kind of duality.

Art
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>> Dare we hope that she was in it? <<

Regardless of what one thinks of someone's politics and personality, that's just plain ugly and despicable. Just what I'd expect from the hypocrite wing of the "tolerance" ideology.


Hey, I'm on record (or would be if TMF had a functional search engine) as hoping that Teddy Kennedy experiences spontaneous remission from his brain tumor - the day after he's formally out of the Senate.

But I guess that's just because I'm a libertarian, and therefore by definition intolerant and unsympathetic, perhaps even hateful.

It takes real liberal compassion to wish for someone to burn to death.
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You honestly can't hear Beauregard Claghorn in the background saying, "it's a joke son, a joke"?

http://www.classiccinemaonline.com/cinema/comedy/itsajokeson...
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You posted a black & white movie over an hour and a half long. Are you insane man? Who the hell is going to watch that?

2828
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You posted a black & white movie over an hour and a half long. Are you insane man? Who the hell is going to watch that?

2828


Angry Candy won't be posting for a while.
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The Christian Science Monitor offered interesting observations a coupla years ago:

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0208/p02s01-ussc.html

In a country with more than 350,000 churches, motives are as varied as the denominations they target, experts say. According to the Insurance Information Institute, the top reasons for torching a church include the coverup of a burglary, vandalism, and revenge. Racism, insurance fraud, and thrill-seeking are less common.

Nearly 1,000 churches burned between 1996 and 2000 nationwide, according to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF). Authorities nabbed about 100 suspects, a pace that has only decreased slightly.

Since the summer of 1996, when a spate of racially motivated Alabama church fires drew national attention, investigators are not much closer to knowing what fuels the church arsonist. Confessions range from the hateful to the mundane: In Suffolk County, Va., an 18-year-old pleaded guilty to torching St. Mary's Catholic Church in October 2005, after stealing a few hot dogs and some sacramental wine in the course of an inebriated evening.
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The good news is that Palin says she is now qualified to apply for the Fire Chief job.
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Thanks to Putnid for providing the link from The Christian Science Monitor:

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0208/p02s01-ussc.html

In a country with more than 350,000 churches, motives are as varied as the denominations they target, experts say. According to the Insurance Information Institute, the top reasons for torching a church include the coverup of a burglary, vandalism, and revenge. Racism, insurance fraud, and thrill-seeking are less common.

Nearly 1,000 churches burned between 1996 and 2000 nationwide, according to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF). Authorities nabbed about 100 suspects, a pace that has only decreased slightly.

Since the summer of 1996, when a spate of racially motivated Alabama church fires drew national attention, investigators are not much closer to knowing what fuels the church arsonist. Confessions range from the hateful to the mundane: In Suffolk County, Va., an 18-year-old pleaded guilty to torching St. Mary's Catholic Church in October 2005, after stealing a few hot dogs and some sacramental wine in the course of an inebriated evening.

__________________________________________
OK, I'm prejudiced, but let's stop blaming the Democrats.

Heck, the election is over, and Palin is a thing of the past, unless she's dumb enough to guest star on "Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader?"

My own personal GUESS, on which I would bet no real money, is that it's one or more idiot teenagers who started up their own faux Satanic cult.

Bill
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OK, I'm prejudiced, but let's stop blaming the Democrats.

Good luck with that. I think some folks just enjoy getting under other folks skin. They have far too much fun watching the reactions they get from posts like the OP. (kinda like how my 15 yo loves to get a rise out of my 10 year old.)

Heck, the election is over, and Palin is a thing of the past,

You honestly don't think she'll run in 2012? I'll be surprised if she doesn't. I'm actually looking forward to watching what she does.

Regardless who did it, they were very sick individuals and I hope they get caught.

b
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Good luck with that. I think some folks just enjoy getting under other folks skin. They have far too much fun watching the reactions they get from posts like the OP. (kinda like how my 15 yo loves to get a rise out of my 10 year old.) - epona

It's the whole point of life. Duality and separation. The more emotional the experience the more powerful and long lasting the memory it creates. It really doesn't matter which side of the argument you are on.

"You honestly don't think she'll run in 2012? I'll be surprised if she doesn't. I'm actually looking forward to watching what she does."

Oh Boy! Another opportunity for Tina Fey to impersonate Sarah Palin. That was some good comedy! "I can see Russia from my house!" "It's gold Jerry, gold!"

"Snicker!"

Artie
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Until you mentioned these posts I had assumed I was, indeed, well versed in your vast body of work.

Now that I realize the existence of your writings heretofore unknown to me I again have the strength to go on living.



I understand. It's like discovering there's a whole new bonus season of Sopranos to be watched.
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OK, I'm prejudiced, but let's stop blaming the Democrats.

Bwahahaha,

The only people "blaming" Democrats were liberals.** The CampFire regulars checked the source and understood that it was a (poor) attempt at satire.

The OP was intended as an indictment of the partisan antics of TMF (not particularly this board). Then the PA board got involved (several mentioning how they wanted "bad things" (like being burned alive) to happen to conservatives). I suppose this means that Alchook's indictment of the partisan process was ENTIRELY correct given the comments voiced in response to his OP (and he got the party affiliation correct too)!

You don't want to "blame Democrats" for the church burning, however, given the above information, do you give us permission to "blame Democrats" for the culture of hate they tolerate/nourish amoungst their rank & file?

** (sorry Alchook, I consider you a lefty even if you're only a left leaning moderate).
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Then the PA board got involved (several mentioning how they wanted "bad things" (like being burned alive) to happen to conservatives).

Again, this underscores how polarized the debate has become. Nobody expressed a desire to see conservatives burned alive.

For all you know they may have wanted the conservatives to die of smoke inhalation before burning.


I suppose this means that Alchook's indictment of the partisan process was ENTIRELY correct given the comments voiced in response to his OP (and he got the party affiliation correct too)!

My indictment was entirely correct both in capitals and bold? With an exclamation point to boot?

I'd say that contradicts your assessment of my satire attempt as poor.

** (sorry Alchook, I consider you a lefty even if you're only a left leaning moderate).

That's OK, most places I'm the board Nazi.

Not that these boards are overly polarized or anything.
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I think the funniest thing about it was you made it an AP story.

2828
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I think the funniest thing about it was you made it an AP story.

2828


I didn't realize people find referencing protocol humor so offensive.
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** (sorry Alchook, I consider you a lefty even if you're only a left leaning moderate).

That's OK, most places I'm the board Nazi.


That's entirely consistent with considering you a lefty.
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That's entirely consistent with considering you a lefty.

Maybe, but I don't really think of myself as being part of the left or being part of the right.

I see myself as the guy who tries to figure out which side has less of a sense of humor.

And I gotta say, it's no small task.
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Maybe, but I don't really think of myself as being part of the left or being part of the right.

I agree with you on most things, disagree on a few, and strongly disagree on a very small number.

Thus I dub thee "moderate lefty".

You appear to have a rational reason for most of your position and that's better than 90+% of people on both sides of the spectrum.
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I agree with you on most things, disagree on a few, and strongly disagree on a very small number.

That's just the nature of the triality we all experience in everyday life.
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