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Interesting statement. You're aware that your conscience isn't entirely clear, but you've decided that plank in your eye can be totally ignored while you attack what you perceive as someone else's. I'm pretty sure the bible speaks against that. But hey, it's your bible. You can ignore it if you want. That's your sin to worry about and I'm not in charge of your soul. I wish you felt the same about others'.

Nobody is excused not one. Thanks be to God we have his son to forgive all of us. All one needs to do is humble him/herself before god, ask forgiveness and accept Christ as their Lord and Savior. Then all manner of misdeeds, past and present, are forgiving.

God (if you believe in such a being, which you seem to) aborts millions of babies. If God does it, it must (by definition) be moral. So, yes, my conscience is also clear on that score.

You may have to elaborate on that one. But even if he did, God is God. He can do what he wants to and we do not have the perspective or the intelligence he does. Does the bowl have the right to question whether or not the potter makes it for nobel or mundane purposes? We are infinately smaller than God. It is a fool's game to question his purposes.

We all do it. Christian and nonChristian. Why did this happen to me? I don't deserve this? THe poor starving child in Africa did not deserve this? But who are we to question God? It's a fool's game. We are all fools.

I'm more worried about the millions of kids who are starving because any type of social program is viewed as omgsocialismgasp! How clear is your conscience on that one?

So preempt them by murdering them in the womb? I can tell you what I have done? DW and I adopted an unwanted bi-racial baby. DW volunteers for Crisis Pregnancy Center. We support missionaries all over the world that not only spread the gospel but get their hands dirty building projects. I've gone on a few missions myself.

As to supporting faceless gov't programs run by robotic employees waiting for their pension to kick in? I've seen those types. In fact, worked at a housing authority for 2 years early in my career. No thanks. They foster the 'entitlement' mentality and perpetuate the problem. Private charities work far better. I've been there, done it. It works.

I'm proud of supporting abortion rights. I'm proud of the many adults whose lives were not destroyed by a pregnancy they never wanted, or that they wanted but that went badly. I'm proud that many unwanted children weren't raised by mothers who never wanted to give birth to them, and who would have told them so. Or who would murder them as toddlers while dealing with post partum depression. Or who would superglue their hands to a wall and beat them into a coma because they wouldn't potty train as fast as the 23 year old mother of 5 would like (she got 99 years in prison today - a few abortions would have been easier on everyone).

After I wrote my post, I suspected I would offend some people. I have many pro-choice friends on RECF and elsewhere. So to qualify my post, it was more of a slam against FMNH who is an obnixious punk that comes over here every day and insults us.

But let me elaborate some. To be proud of pro-abortion? That's becoming the new thing with radical leftwingers now. It used to be that abortion was just considered a "necessary evil". I remember abortion being huge in debates during the 1980's. Even those who supported it were not happy about it. They admitted that it was probably killing a life. Even Dukakis during the 88 election, when pressed about his pro-abortion stance stated something like, "I don't support abortion, abortion is a bad thing. I'm pro choice and support others to make their own decisions."

Now it's a badge of honor. If you don't support ripping babies body parts with a scapel or suction hose, you are immoral. Wow! I'm the immoral one.

"In the end days, they will call good evil and they will call evil good".

I wonder how much time we have left.

I wish God had a way to keep people from ever getting pregnant unless they wanted to, could afford to, and the baby would be healthy. Until then, we humans will do our best to correct bad situations, and be proud of doing so.

I'm a proponent of abstinence. But I'm all for people using protection and birth control mechanisms. That's where the choice is.

From a moral standpoint, I think if you get pregnant, you now have the responsiblity to figure out how to get that child raised, either by yourself or give it for adoption. There are lot's of people that want kids that can't have them. I know a middle class couple that ended up spending tens of thousands of $ to get 3 children from overseas. If more children were available in the states, the cost would have been far less. But we abort most of our unwanted children instead.

From a libertarian POV, I think each state has the right to decide how it wants to approach abortion. I appose many of the religious right organisations that want a federal law or constitutional amendement to prevent it. Row v Wade was bad law and stepped on the rights of states. Bring it back to them.

I like you Frydaze and again, I realize this is an extremely sensitive issue. I hope we can agree to disagree. Same goes to those on RECF that disagree with me.

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