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<<Had to take one 'humanities' course a semester for first 3 years. One was anthropology. Forgot 99% of it the day I graduated along with psychology and some other stuff I don't even remember I took. I didn't find myself and it was a distraction.


t>>

I was a member of the University of Washington Amateur Radio Club. An EE major talked about the need for courses like that to provide intellectual "breadth" to college graduates.

He thought there was a lot to recommend that ----and suggested that every college graduate be required to complete a year of regular college calculus to obtain that breadth.


Seattle Pioneer
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Of course, other than STEM programs, most college education is more about liberal indoctrination and brainwashing rather than useful subjects.

Average debt of $33,000 for essentially basket weaving degree.....and even then, not being a good basket weaver.



t
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Of course, other than STEM programs, most college education is more about liberal indoctrination and brainwashing rather than useful subjects.

Odd little world you live in.
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tele writes,

"College debt was followed by chosen area of study (12%) as a top regret for employees, though this varied greatly by major. Other regrets include poor networking, school choice, too many degrees, time spent completing education and academic underachievement.

Most satisfied: Those with science, technology, engineering and math majors, who are typically more likely to enjoy higher salaries,

Most regrets: Humanities majors, who are least likely to earn higher pay post-graduation, were most likely to regret their college education.

</snip>


This is one of the few things I agree with tele on.

My college education was strictly an employment credential. And I didn't waste any motion taking a course that didn't directly affect whether or not I graduated. (That's the reason I completed my engineering degree in 3 years.)

You need to be very wealthy to pay for a college education as a means to "find yourself".

intercst
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<<You need to be very wealthy to pay for a college education as a means to "find yourself".

intercst>>



I agree---- since that's more or less what I did.


Seattle Pioneer
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<<You need to be very wealthy to pay for a college education as a means to "find yourself".

intercst>>



I agree---- since that's more or less what I did.


Seattle Pioneer


Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren have a plan for that :)

Andy
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I have no regrets about studying anthropology (OK, the tuition scholarship helped).
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intercst:"My college education was strictly an employment credential. And I didn't waste any motion taking a course that didn't directly affect whether or not I graduated. (That's the reason I completed my engineering degree in 3 years.)

You need to be very wealthy to pay for a college education as a means to "find yourself"."

- ---

It took me 4 years and I don't think I could have done it in much less for my BSEE - just couldn't take the required courses in 3 as they all had prerequisites and only taught every other semester in sequence.. Didn't take any extra courses or change majors, which impact a fair number of college kids today as they don't know what they want to do in college and flip-flop around.

Think I did 'grow up' a whole lot during those 4 years. Did work summers earning some bucks and that was an education in itself.

First summer job was working on the Ford Assembly line at Mahwah NJ making new cars. For a couple weeks put the rubber seals around doors. Loved two door cars - only had to do the left side.. 4 door cars took twice as much work. Every 68 seconds another car. took about 55 seconds to finish, then you had 10 seconds to walk back (line was moving all the time) and get set for the next car. 10 hours a day. Making fantastic money - like 4x minimum pay with evening shift bonus.....then spent couple weeks moving cars 200 feet from end of assembly line up to water test where they soaked the cars to see if they leaked anywhere. Car after car after car. One every couple minutes. Get in, move seat back, start car, move it 200 feet or so, walk back for next car. Two of us doing that. Half hour break for lunch when we all piled in new car, drove the mile to the cafeteria, ate, then back. One new car every day had 2 extra miles on it. Job lasted six weeks so some regular folks could take vacations at that time. Then plant shut down for retooling for new models. Absolutely boring as heck. Those working on the line all seemed to be able to just focus on the big bucks they were earning - big union wages and were happy to be employed. Learned NEVER to want a factory or assembly line job very well that summer. Totally wiped out after 3 weeks. NOT FOR ME!

Second summer job was with the telephone company- my dad worked for Ma Bell and they provided summer jobs for the employees kids. Did a whole bunch of things from un-installing phones and disconnecting wires to the apartments. You learn amazing things like in many areas of NYC, back in the 1960s, a telephone , even in the hallway and shared, was a 'status symbol' for many. You took their phone, or tried to, and that was like losing a child. Even if it didn't work! (disconnected at the central office). Spent a couple weeks pulling 25 pair cables in/out under raised floors in big office buildings. Got the job done many days in a few hours, but the bosses said - you got 8 hours allocated for this task....use them. Never finish early (union rules allocated so much time for each task).....so we got the work done, then goofed off rest of day. Decent pay - about twice minimum wage back then. Did that for 10 weeks then back to college after a week 'vacation' or so.

Next summer I got smarter - got my FCC First Class Commercial license over spring break - got great summer job as Broadcast Technician at WGY/WRGB/WGFM in Schenectady NY.. Good pay - 3x minimum wage. Did a lot from setting up the clunky TV cameras of the day each morning, to running film chains, to master control for hours every day for the 50KW clear channel AM station. No union stuff to worry about - we were 'excused' from having to join union as those guys wanted to take vacations in the summer and we filled in - as long as we had the FCC License....<g>. Good job and if you flunked out of college, it would have been a half decent career with stability and not being bored to death.

Made good use of those 4 years and learned a lot about 'life' mostly outside of the class room.....

After 4 years, decided I had more than enough college education. The smarter folks usually went on to complete a master's degree in another 12-18 months if they had the financial resources. Not me.

20 years later, I went back for my MSEE degree. my company paid. Best way. Took it part time evenings and finished in 2.5 years going year round. Had a blast. Thoroughly enjoyed it.

Did I ever regret my college education? Nope. (and those who skipped college usually would up with a free tour of southeast asia courtesy of Uncle Sam - Vietnam War was raging all through my college years. )




t.
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"I have no regrets about studying anthropology (OK, the tuition scholarship helped)."

Had to take one 'humanities' course a semester for first 3 years. One was anthropology. Forgot 99% of it the day I graduated along with psychology and some other stuff I don't even remember I took. I didn't find myself and it was a distraction.


t
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<<Had to take one 'humanities' course a semester for first 3 years. One was anthropology. Forgot 99% of it the day I graduated along with psychology and some other stuff I don't even remember I took. I didn't find myself and it was a distraction.


t>>

I was a member of the University of Washington Amateur Radio Club. An EE major talked about the need for courses like that to provide intellectual "breadth" to college graduates.

He thought there was a lot to recommend that ----and suggested that every college graduate be required to complete a year of regular college calculus to obtain that breadth.


Seattle Pioneer
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I have no regrets about studying anthropology (OK, the tuition scholarship helped).

I have a couple Lib Arts/Humanities degrees but I didn't get them to get a job with. I already had a job. Just wanted my "ticket punched." A degree in anything meant credibility. No degree? No credibility. OK. If that's how they want to play the game.

I tested out of all requirements for History, Sociology, Chemistry, and Biology. (Came up a few points short on the math testing fusillade.) But they wouldn't give me the degrees in Chem and Bio without the lab requirements. Would have taken too much time and motivation. So, I went with the labless majors. I have always been a History buff since 4th grade anyway, so for me it was one of those "self-fulfillment" things. I aced the GRE in History. The counselors made a big deal out of it. The way I saw it after the dust settled was, any reasonably educated person can do this and the whole college mishigass is oversold, overrated and over priced. I was 32 years old and hadn't been "in school" in 14 years. At least I didn't have to sit in a classroom for 4 yrs and listen to some "petty gogue" tell me the 20% of things he knows.

If you need the pedigree, if you were any kind of a student, you're about 70% there without even realizing it. The proprietary stuff? Not sure you can pick up what you need to know from a book for many engineering degrees and such. Ok, you'll have to go to school and listen to somebody and take notes.
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Typical RWNJ nonsense from whoever you were replying to.

No appreciation that real education encompasses more than "useful subjects."

My career has been enhanced, perhaps largely dependent on, my analytical and editing skills, which I learned in high school; not on the math, physics, and chemistry classes in which I did very well, or on most of what I learned in law school.

Wessex <<B.Sc. Finance, J.D., but despite those degrees, always trying to be better in non-STEM subjects as well.
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I certainly don't dispute the greater (average) earnings potential of STEM graduates. On the other hand, my college teaching career and my experiences as an overeducated, but generally very enthusiastic, liberal arts student suggest there's no point pushing people into what makes them miserable or for which they have no aptitude. (The "how many ______s does it take to screw in a light bulb?" joke could have been composed with me in mind. :) )

Steve
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I certainly don't dispute the greater (average) earnings potential of STEM graduates. On the other hand, my college teaching career and my experiences as an overeducated, but generally very enthusiastic, liberal arts student suggest there's no point pushing people into what makes them miserable or for which they have no aptitude. (The "how many ______s does it take to screw in a light bulb?" joke could have been composed with me in mind. :) )

Steve


If you are OK with the idea of "You can get money anywhere", then the degree you get doesn't have to be something you don't like. But you will have to perhaps, settle for less OR be a multi-degreed liberal arts plumber. Or cab driver. Those two concepts don't usually go together though. Personally I would do something a la intrcst. Get a degree in something that pays well upfront. (He was lucky in that e actually liked being a CE) Save it like you're gonna die if you don't. Then punch out early and go on to do that thing you really like to do even if it doesn't pay.

In my case I enlisted in the Air Force because where I came from it was really the only option other than riding the rails like a hobo. I did not like it. But for some reason I was good at it. The job had potential and a ladder to climb, a pension and lifetime medical insurance. The more time I had in the harder it was to leave. Golden handcuffs maybe but it only lasts 20 yrs. A long time at 18. Not so long at 26.
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FCorelli writes,

In my case I enlisted in the Air Force because where I came from it was really the only option other than riding the rails like a hobo. I did not like it. But for some reason I was good at it. The job had potential and a ladder to climb, a pension and lifetime medical insurance. The more time I had in the harder it was to leave. Golden handcuffs maybe but it only lasts 20 yrs. A long time at 18. Not so long at 26.

</snip>


I never considered the military as a career since I figured I could make more money in industry. But when I lived in San Diego in the late 1980's I had a girlfriend who was a Recruiter in the Navy. And she kept trying to get me to join with the pitch, "Since you have experience, you'll start at a higher rank." I said, "Yeah I understand that, but you'll have to bring me in as an Admiral to make it cost competitive with what I'm doing now."

But actually the military is a pretty good deal if you live in a high cost area like San Diego or San Francisco where you're getting a large housing adjustment if you live off base. With the adjustment, it almost competitive with a typical civilian salary. But that goes away if you get transferred. One of her Navy colleagues got transferred to the Naval Station in Pascagoula, Mississippi and the housing allowance virtually disappeared.

intercst
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<< I said, "Yeah I understand that, but you'll have to bring me in as an Admiral to make it cost competitive with what I'm doing now.">>


We missed out on Admiral intercst by just THAT much!


<< I lived in San Diego in the late 1980's I had a girlfriend who was a Recruiter in the Navy. And she kept trying to get me to join with the pitch, "Since you have experience, you'll start at a higher rank.">>


Probably missed out on being a battleship commander during "Desert Storm."


Seattle Pioneer
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One of the best tech writers I worked with had a law degree. The very best writer had a masters in fine arts (studio art).
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One of the best tech writers I worked with had a law degree. The very best writer had a masters in fine arts (studio art).

It's curious. Choose the "wrong" major in college, and somehow you deserve to be unemployed and drowning in debt.

But out-of-work coal miners should get free money, because their plight is all Obama's fault.
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My personal college regret had nothing to do with my career choice. I wanted to be a teacher and had a 37 year career as one. I wish I had been a better student early in my college career. Once I became a good student even classes that I was not particularly enthralled with became fun.

The debt load students are burdened with is unconscionable. The average student debt load at a public university is more than two times my four years at a private college with no financial aid cost. How many students would be more satisfied with their majors if they weren't deep in debt.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/zackfriedman/2019/02/25/student...
Public Colleges: 66% of borrowers who graduated from public colleges have student loan debt. Average student loan debt at public colleges is $25,550, which is 25% higher today than it was in 2008.

Private Non-Profit Colleges: 75% of borrowers who graduated from private non-profit colleges have student loan debt. Average student loan debt at private non-profit colleges is $32,300, which is 15% higher today than it was in 2008.

For-Profit Colleges: 88% of borrowers who graduated from for-profit colleges have student loan debt. Average student loan debt at for-profit colleges is $39,950, which is 26% higher today than it was in 2008.


I wonder if those who attended for-profit college are the most regretful.

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2018/08/for-pr...
Research has shown that for-profit colleges disproportionately enroll black students, single parents, and older students. On its face, that seems like a good thing, since it means increased access to higher education. But for-profits tend to be more expensive, have lower six-year graduation rates, and lead students to take out more loans that they are more likely to default on.
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intercst:"But actually the military is a pretty good deal if you live in a high cost area like San Diego or San Francisco where you're getting a large housing adjustment if you live off base. With the adjustment, it almost competitive with a typical civilian salary. But that goes away if you get transferred. One of her Navy colleagues got transferred to the Naval Station in Pascagoula, Mississippi and the housing allowance virtually disappeared."


Have a friend who rose to rank of Colonel. He spent 30 years in military and retired. Gets a nice pension. He was single and usually stayed on base - Germany - US -

Now retired.

Travels all over, and stays at military bases in officer's quarters - cheap - hops occasional military flight here and there on standby basis so travels worldwide.

Oh....and still gets military system health benefits.....

Have another friend - he is ex-military. went to HI and stayed at officer's housing - he's married. Cheap vacation to HI with something like $25/night cost......


t.
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That's a little grayling world.. Sad, really..
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