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Everybody,

There's no question that the actions and inactions of four Minneapolis police officers that caused the death of George Floyd while in police custody for a non-violent offense are utterly deplorable and completely repulsive. I had to wait a few days for my own emotions to calm down before posting anything about that incident.

There's nothing worse than a corrupt cop -- and the video of the incident shows that there were four of them. It is very much to the city's credit that the chief and the mayor moved swiftly to dismiss all four of these scoundrels from the force. They deserve to face criminal charges -- one for either murder or manslaughter, depending upon details of the case and nuances of the law, and the other three as accessories thereto. However, the prosecutors clearly need a few days for an investigation to gather the evidence, determine the correct level of charge, and present the case to a grand jury to obtain indictments before making arrests. In the case at hand, it's likely that the District Attorney has to await the coroner's report on an autopsy to ascertain the cause of death.

I fully understand the frustration with what's perceived to be police brutality resulting in the deaths of many black people and the fact that the racial dimensions of the present case fit into that pattern. Thus, I fully support peaceful protests -- I'm there in spirit! I was really thrilled when the protests in Minneapolis seemed to be peaceful -- well, initially.

But something went terribly wrong. Anarchists took over, and what started out as a peaceful protest turned into mayhem and senseless destruction, the impact of which falls most heavily on the minority community that live in Precinct 3. Many of the small businesses that fell victim to looting and arson are owned by people who live in that neighborhood, and the people who are now out of work because those businesses are gone are people who live in that neighborhood. As President Reagan once quipped, "They aimed at the rich, and missed." I don't understand how damage and destruction that really hurt people who already have suffered so much does anything to further the cause. Rather, it actually has diverted attention away from the death of Mr. Floyd and caused it to focus on the perpetrators of this senseless mayhem. This is even more true of violent protests in other places. I grieve all the more for the people who suffer needlessly because of this violence.

I think that there are two different groups turning out in our cities in the evening. One group is coming to protest peacefully, while another group is coming to wreak havoc. The authorities need to protect the first while stopping the second.

There's a lot else that does not make sense.

>> In the case at hand, the officer in whose hands Mr. Floyd actually died apparently had a record of many other incidents, albeit of lesser magnitude. So why was he still on the force, and what role did the officers of the police unions play in demanding his retention on the force in the aftermath of his previous transgressions?

>> Why are all of the incidents of black people getting killed by police occurring in cities with a long legacy of mayors who purport to care about black people (yes, all Democrats), why have several generations of such mayors not succeeded in addressing the many issues that impact such communities, and why have the leaders of the minority communities continued to support such elected officials?

>> In Atlanta, why did the renegades attack the building of a national cable news outlet that, at least until now, has been highly sympathetic to their cause? How bone-headed is that???

>> And, for that matter, why did a band of thugs suddenly show up in Atlanta -- a city that, even according to Fox News, has a longstanding legacy of peaceful protest in these situations?

There's a lot here for which we need to pray.

>> First and foremost, we need to pray for an end to the violence.

>> Second, we need to pray for justice in the immediate case.

>> Third, we need to pray that our cities will elect mayors who will provide the leadership to fix the problems that persist in their so-called "inner city" neighborhoods instead of squandering money on salaries of bungling bureaucrats who perpetuate such problems under the pretense of fixing them.

>> And, fourth, we need to pray that we can resolve these problems before they tear our country completely apart.

Norm.
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Everybody,

Further details: Apparently Mr. Floyd and the officer who restrained him were not strangers.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/george-floyd-worked-officer-charg...

This is the sort of information that's critical to criminal prosecution -- it could provide the motive for elevation of the charge. This is the reason why a thorough investigation is necessary.

Norm.
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Restaurant management stayed that one worked inside, the other outside and did not necessarily know each other.

Anyone interested in this should read the complaint. The coroner findings are in the penultimate paragraph. The cause of death will probably be a big defense point of contention.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6933246/Derek-Cha...

Finally, many of the thugs came in from the suburbs. How is their destruction furthering the interests of urban people? Why don’t they burn down their own homes first?
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CMFMutwa ~

Thanks for providing the link to the report. It shares stated facts of what happened during the entire minutes in question. I am not excusing Officer Chauven's (or the other officers) behavior in any way. What usually happens is that we have a group of people that are basically like old-time vigilantes who take the law into their own hands except these people feel that violence is a right in order to make a point.

It seems Mr. Floyd was not cooperative and refused to get into the backseat of the squad car after initially resisting arrest and then proceeded to act out by stiffening his body and intentionally falling. I am guessing that is standard procedure so that the handcuffed person cannot interfere with the officer driving. We can all read what was explained. As with some past times of arrest there was and is more to the story than initially thought.
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Paul,

Finally, many of the thugs came in from the suburbs.

I would be surprised if that is the case, but it's clear from the footage that the looting is a coordinated effort with a lot of individuals functioning as a team.

However, I have heard experts say that professional agitators who do not live in the cities are coordinating and inciting the violence in recent television coverage. These experts explained their modus operandi and identified the individuals whom they believed to be these agitators in the footage of the rioting. These individuals are not at the front of the crowd, so the police need to go undercover and get into the crowd to apprehend them.

How is their destruction furthering the interests of urban people?

It does not further anything. Rather, it's totally senseless.

Norm.
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Robin,

It seems Mr. Floyd was not cooperative and refused to get into the backseat of the squad car after initially resisting arrest and then proceeded to act out by stiffening his body and intentionally falling. I am guessing that is standard procedure so that the handcuffed person cannot interfere with the officer driving. We can all read what was explained. As with some past times of arrest there was and is more to the story than initially thought.

If the police could not get him into the back seat of the cruiser, they should have simply called in a "paddy wagon" and loaded him in the back of it. I find it hard to believe that the police department of a major city (Minneapolis) does not have a "paddy wagon."

Norm.
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Norm;

I am not excusing the death of Mr. Floyd in any way. I agree that the officers should have called for backup and ordered another type of vehicle. I was simply stating that there is often more than what initially is told or shown. I have found that to be true in a lot of cases.


RobYn
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Robin,

I was simply stating that there is often more than what initially is told or shown. I have found that to be true in a lot of cases.

Yes, absolutely!

"Things are seldom what they seem;
Skim milk masquerades as cream."
. . . . . -- Lord W. S. Gilbert, in HMS Pinnafore

That's precisely why it's absolutely imperative for authorities do a comprehensive investigation before bringing charges, even with what seems to be clear evidence in a video clip.

Norm.
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Norm, I appreciate your appreciation for not jumping into judgement as I don't consider 2 days before murder charges were brought as extensive. It is very important that everything proceed by the book so there are no loose ends.

Also, I know this is just my bugaboo ...... my name is spelled Robyn. I tried to, unsuccessfully, highlight it in my last post. Sorry if it seems extreme to point it out.
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Robyn,

Also, I know this is just my bugaboo ...... my name is spelled Robyn. I tried to, unsuccessfully, highlight it in my last post. Sorry if it seems extreme to point it out.

No, my bad. It has been so long since I replied to one of your posts that I think I just forgot the spelling, so thank you for pointing it out. You absolutely deserve the respect of the rest of us spelling your name correctly. I apologize, and ask your forgiveness, for my mistake.

Norm.
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>> Why are all of the incidents of black people getting killed by police occurring in cities with a long legacy of mayors who purport to care about black people (yes, all Democrats), why have several generations of such mayors not succeeded in addressing the many issues that impact such communities, and why have the leaders of the minority communities continued to support such elected officials?>>

Norm, Are you really this ignorant... or are you pretending to be this ignorant... White policemen have been killing black men since the civil war... the only thing that has changed recently is cell phones recording video.

Freed slaves were promised land and the GOP refused to fund it.

It is not just a racial issue it is also an economic issue. When a black community becomes economically viable it is frequently targeted and sometimes in our history it has been violent... it is not just native American villages that were massacred.
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Norm, you are very kind to respond. Of course, I know that it was not intentional. Forgiveness already happened even if you didn't say anything.

God bless you!


Robyn
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Lawrence,

White policemen have been killing black men since the civil war... the only thing that has changed recently is cell phones recording video.

In some places, yes. In other places, no.

Freed slaves were promised land and the GOP refused to fund it.

There was a whole lot else that failed when the slaves were set free, too. For starters, they were not given an opportunity to acquire education.

I dare say that the last sixty years of our lifetime are a lot more relevant than a century and a half ago.

It is not just a racial issue it is also an economic issue.

Actually, what I see is much more of an economic issue than a racial issue. In the city of Boston, which is much closer to my home than I would like, the white disadvantaged neighborhoods have exactly the same problems as the black disadvantaged neighborhoods.

But the root of the economic issue is an educational issue that has persisted for decades. Except for a couple prestigious "exam" high schools, the city of Boston's public schools are a stark contrast to those of the surrounding suburban communities -- even the suburban communities that are just as economically disadvantaged as the city. And for the record, the city of Boston spends more per student on its public school system than any suburban community.

But at the root of the educational issue is a political establishment that pays lip service to education while using the school system's central administration as a place to provide "good jobs at good wages" to connected friends of influential politicians who have no competence in education, that perpetuates curricula that have been proven to fail, and that endorses "social promotion" of students who fail to master the material that they should learn in each grade anyway, setting those students up for failure in the next grade because they lack an adequate foundation for the next grade's material.

And also at the root of the economic issue is a welfare system that historically ensnared people in dependence that often endured for generations rather than helping people to develop the skill sets to find productive and gainful employment and empowering them to move up the economic ladder, sustained by the very same political establishment that runs the city's schools.

When a black community becomes economically viable it is frequently targeted and sometimes in our history it has been violent... it is not just native American villages that were massacred.

That's deplorable where it happened.

But, again, that's not universally true everywhere.

Norm.
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It seems Mr. Floyd was not cooperative and refused to get into the backseat of the squad car after initially resisting arrest and then proceeded to act out by stiffening his body and intentionally falling.

==========================

It's hard to see, but it looks like he was put in on the driver's side...then we see him down on the passenger side. How did he get from one side to the other. I'm pretty sure there are no door knobs on the inside of the back seat. There is another vehicle in the way to see everything. That is why they need to release the body cam video.
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Jean,

It's hard to see, but it looks like he was put in on the driver's side...then we see him down on the passenger side. How did he get from one side to the other. I'm pretty sure there are no door knobs on the inside of the back seat. There is another vehicle in the way to see everything. That is why they need to release the body cam video.

Public release of information before a criminal case goes to trial causes big problems for the courts because it prejudices the pool of potential jurors. Thus, the investigators and the prosecutors should not release any details about a crime until the case actually goes to trial.

Of course, the authorities cannot stop private citizens from posting videos of a crime to U-Tube or from discussing a crime on the Internet or on a radio talk show. That's our right to free speech and freedom of the press, guaranteed by the first amendment. And they also can't stop the news media from reporting the details of a crime that their reporters can ascertain.

Norm.
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