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No. of Recommendations: 5
I think we discussed this before, but I don't recall a solid answer was given.

Normally, if you plan to leave your job they want 2 weeks' notice. Well, I'm retiring. Even with a pandemic lock-down, I'm just soooo done. I'm assuming 2 weeks is not enough. From a practical standpoint, I could just leave. I don't need a recommendation in the future. But I harbor no ill-will, and I'm a stockholder, so I would rather exit gracefully.

I'm thinking two months' notice. That gives them time to interview, get someone for me to "show the ropes"**. Enough? I'm assuming I have to notify both my manager and HR (that is probably company-dependent, but I wouldn't think it ideal for a manager to hear it from HR before he hears it from me).

Etiquette isn't my strong suit.

1poorguy




**I'm not going to be able to train a new failure analysis person...that takes on the order of a year since they don't teach that in college. But I can at least show them what is where, and who to talk to if various situations arise.
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I'm thinking two months' notice. That gives them time to interview, get someone for me to "show the ropes"**. Enough? I'm assuming I have to notify both my manager and HR (that is probably company-dependent, but I wouldn't think it ideal for a manager to hear it from HR before he hears it from me).

Etiquette isn't my strong suit.


Since you really don't care when, let your supervisor know you would be willing to work with them within reason, and let them tell you how much time they would like. Negotiate from there. Some companies will escort you out the door that very moment, some try to milk you for every second they can get. Also consider leaving yourself open to contracting to train the replacement. It can be much more rewarding financially, particularly if you already have the benefits covered with retiree benefits.

You don't owe them anything. It's great that you want to be accommodating, but make it worth your while. DH went from 60+ hour weeks on salary, to being paid $220/hour with increments of 15 minutes, and paid from the moment he left the door of the house. Checking emails? Charge them for that. So much work time the average salaried employee does for free.

Contracting can be a nice transition to retirement if you have the expertise they want.
IP
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We're so close to the next ESPP purchase, that I would want that to trigger before I depart. Otherwise, I don't care when. I could leave tomorrow. But the ESPP is a little over a month away, and it's a nice perk.

1pg
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No. of Recommendations: 15
We're so close to the next ESPP purchase, that I would want that to trigger before I depart. Otherwise, I don't care when. I could leave tomorrow. But the ESPP is a little over a month away, and it's a nice perk.

Then be careful about giving notice until after you can do that purchase.

Bro felt he was such a big deal in the company he was working for that he gave them a year's notice. They had security walk him out. Didn't want to give him the time to gather secrets and clients to take with him to a competitor.

Be ready to leave when you give notice. It's not certain how it will be taken.

IP
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1poorguy, I think your gut instinct is correct, go for 2 months and see what they say. They depend on you for the work that you do and it’s a considerate thing to do to give the extra notice. I don’t think they can use a fill-in person right off the bat if you left your job in two weeks. Give them a heads up.

What’s that saying? Do unto others what you would like done for you.

And another one is, how would you like to be remembered? You left them hanging out to dry or that you were considerate enough to give them some time to get their ducks in a row?

My 3 cents :)
Dog
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Two months seems reasonable. I’d wait until after the ESPP to give notice, though. Just to be safe.

And: congratulations!! I’m so jealous!! 😁
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My boss and just about everyone else knows I'm retiring October 1. Yet I won't actually send my resignation letter until sometime later this year.

PSU
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Two months sounds good. If you give more than that, they'll just procrastinate on finding your replacement, and then say, "What, you were serious?" when you bring it up again two months before your departure.
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There is a superb web site for such a question: https://www.askamanager.org/

Anyone who works would benefit from the discussions there. Great advice!
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Let your manager know first, privately, after the ESPP happens. The manager is the one that will be impacted. HR's role is t crossing and i-dotting; telling you to fill out this form, contact that benefits department, and telling the manager to tell IT security when your last day is via email/form, etc. If they're like my companies, that's all they are.
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I gave notice in November that I would retire some time around the end of this school year--I work for a school, and that's pretty standard there, although generally it's teachers and they need to hire replacements well in advance. I do accounting and will probably end up staying through our audit this summer to close out the fiscal year, although sometimes I feel like if they would escort me out the door now, I'd be dancing all the way (and I don't even dance). :-)

I want to give the school plenty of time to plan for replacing me (I've been there 30 years) and to find a good person and get them properly situated. I didn't give a firm date, and left the door open to accommodate the school's timing if they had another idea of what would be good timing, or if they stumbled across a good person sooner. I'm close with my boss--we've worked together the full 30 years--and I don't want to put her in a bad situation.

Watching how some other people's exits have gone, I may need to give a firm date at some point or I will be there longer than planned. And given that many parts of my job are on a yearly cycle, I expect I will get calls for a while after I leave, asking how to do things (or asking what the heck I did when I did x...)
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1poorguy,

Congratulations!! I'm sure you've worked long and hard to be able to make this life change!

I agree that it's best to wait for your variable compensation to get settled before having a discussion with your manager. I think it all depends on your individual situation.

I retired from an IT leadership role of a large global team that was trying to move mountains within a $25B organization. I had a very large organization and budgetary responsibility. I gave my boss 6 months notice (which he conveniently just ignored) right after I cut the last check for our last kid's university. I think it was about 2 months before my targeted quit date when I approached him and really had a heart to heart chat with him about accepting and planning for my departure.

So if your think that two months seems reasonable, I'd go with that. But, I’d wait until after the ESPP to give notice, though. Just to be safe.

All the Best ~
'38Packard
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I think it depends on your particular situation and your relationship with your boss.

In my case, my boss knew a couple of years prior to my retirement that it was coming, and when I finally settled on a date, I gave her a year notice. She informed her manager, who was the VP of our division as it made a difference in staffing plans. Interestingly enough, he gave her approval to hire my replacement a year ahead so that I could train them (I was the only one doing that function in the company), but she was in denial that I'd ever retire and dragged her feet.

One of the reasons that I gave such a long notice was that I did not want to receive stock options as part of my quarterly bonus since I was not going to be around for them to vest. Giving them my intentions early allowed them to adjust my bonus so that it was all cash, and give the options to someone who would be around for their vesting.

I ended up moving my retirement date out one month when my boss pointed out that I'd get one more bonus if I did that.

In my case, my company treated me very well even knowing when I was going to retire. I do think it makes a difference between retirement and just leaving for a new opportunity, and so there was very little chance that I was going to be walked out the door.

I left on very good terms, and 3 years later, I am still in contact with a lot of the folks who were there including my boss who retired last year. But it really depends on each individual situation.
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No. of Recommendations: 18
I'm thinking two months' notice.

This is a mistake. Do not make it.

There are exactly two things giving extra notice will do for you: Jack and squat. It is 100% downside, no upside.

If you make this mistake, what you will find is that they will rapidly replace you in their minds. Your opinion regarding any future project (which is all of them) will not be valued because you won't be there. You will be a ghost in meetings. You won't be seen as part of the team anymore. They will naturally start thinking of work arounds that don't involve you. Your last two months will be a death march, at best.

As others have pointed out, they might not even take your offer. At which point you will come to understand how much your generosity is appreciated. Here's an experiment. Stick your arm in a bowl of water. Remove you arm. Record how much the water level has changed. That is the exact measure of how much they value your extra notice.

And fair is fair. If there were layoffs coming, you would get exactly no notice. Why do you owe them consideration they refuse to extend to you?

Now, you are not a savage. If they truly value your contributions and wish that you stay on for some additional period to ease the transition, then of course you should entertain the offer, as a reasonable person should. Perhaps you stay on at full salary for a time of mutual agreement. Perhaps you could consult with them at a lucrative rate. You're leaving. You hold all the cards. It is the company's job to make the counter offer. But get it in writing.
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As a manager, I'd appreciate a heads up in the manner of: "Hey, just so you know, I'm seriously thinking about retiring sometime this year." That at least puts it on my radar. I don't care about the actual date until we're ready to lock it in with HR, but some advance notice so I can plan projects without getting blindsided by unexpected attrition. That said, I like to think of myself as an easygoing manager. The relationship with my employees is that we could discuss plans for someone's planned departure without anyone's feelings getting hurt or asking security to escort someone out of the building.
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We're so close to the next ESPP purchase, that I would want that to trigger before I depart. Otherwise, I don't care when. I could leave tomorrow. But the ESPP is a little over a month away, and it's a nice perk.

I was in a similar situation in late 2020, and here's what I had planned:

-Work though the February date where the bonus for hitting previous year's metrics was paid out

-Ask if there were any "packages" anticipated that quarter. The "package" is some severance given for a voluntary layoff.
---->If there were any packages, evaluate whether another six months pay would be worth working another X months past my target leaving date

-Otherwise, give two weeks notice after getting the bonus. If the company asks to stay longer, evaluate the offer to see if it's worth staying the extra time.

Advantages to being laid off vs. just leaving:
-Possible severance
-Unemployment payments (if you're interested in looking for a different job--sounds like this doesn't fit you)
-Eligibility for COBRA health insurance
-The government may pick up some of your health insurance cost. For those laid off in 2020 due to Covid, the federal government paid April - September health insurance payments. (There were some restrictions, like you had to be on COBRA I think.)

With all the 2020 layoffs at my company and problems in my industry, there wasn't any 2020 bonus.
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Now, you are not a savage. If they truly value your contributions and wish that you stay on for some additional period to ease the transition, then of course you should entertain the offer, as a reasonable person should. Perhaps you stay on at full salary for a time of mutual agreement. Perhaps you could consult with them at a lucrative rate. You're leaving. You hold all the cards. It is the company's job to make the counter offer. But get it in writing.

Yes, get it in writing, including waiver of liability for your work for them as a contractor, which is something you enjoy as an employee.

DH found that with his much higher than employee contractor rates, the bullsh!t work went to other people and the level of interest his job provided actually went up. I minded much less the (fewer) hours he spent working, knowing he was doing projects that interested him and he was getting paid for all the work he put in, not having extra work thrown on top of a full plate because work knew he was dependable and seemed to think you should work 24 hours a day when salaried. It was a great way to transition into retirement, both for him and the company.

Retirement is awesome. Congratulations on getting there.

IP
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In today's world giving 2 weeks notice is a standard anymore. Obviously if you don't want to burn bridges you want to be careful but people do all kinds of stuff. I've never given more than 2 weeks noticed and have left anything from 0 to 2 weeks.

I once worked for a place that essentially just placed you into positions at other sites and spoke with 2 ladies that worked there and I kind of reported to and asked them about giving notice. They essentially told me (this was late 2001) burn your leave and just quit. I guess they didn't trust the new management so that is what I did.

In other cases I resigned after finishing projects and left after a day. In another case the manager said he'd cover my health insurance for a month if I wanted to leave at the end of the week which was fine to me. I always like to take off weeks between jobs.

Too many people think they owe something to a company but you don't. And when cuts come, companies can be ruthless. I've never been laid off or unemployed (except by choice) but people give too much to companies in many cases.

With retirement sometimes you have to give more notice depending on the paperwork involved. At least with the government they often would like 3+ months notice.

I'm trying to hang in there until the end of the year.
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Etiquette isn't my strong suit.


Only you know what your relationship with your manager and the company is like.
I would wait until after the ESPP and/or any other bonuses or stock vesting is locked in, then approach my manager and tell him/her that you are going to retire and give an approximate date.
Say that you will notify HR in writing giving 2 weeks notice but you are giving him/her a heads up.

Since you are retiring and not going to a competitor you will likely not get walked out.
Then see what your manager does. Might ignore it for a while or might start looking for a replacement. You can then put in your 2 weeks notice whenever you want, knowing you gave them plenty of time. If you are suddenly out of the loop you can leave sooner. If they are really looking but not finding a good replacement you might stay a bit longer. It they don't seem to be seriously looking you can choose to leave any time.
Also, keep the communications with your manager going.

Mike
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As others have said, wait until your ESPP is locked in before giving notice.

Have you checked your employee agreement (you probably signed something when you started) and/or the HR Manual for notice requirements? It’s usually spelled out there.

Be prepared for both extremes; being walked out when you give notice to being asked to stick around for a few months.

I only have 1 regret about being retired. I waited too long.

Enjoy your retirement!!

AW
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After reading all the input, I'm going to wait until after 3/1. I expect I won't get walked. I've never given them a reason to do that. And I've seen several folks retire over the years. Usually their groups give them a lunch or something before they depart. Plus apparently policy is giving some small bonus (like $500) for some reason.

Anyway, I'll wait a little longer before saying anything.

1poorguy (weird retiring as my portfolio diminishes, but I knew the market could/would fluctuate...hopefully this isn't a long bear like in the 70s)
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I'm dealing with the same question, but I work in the nonprofit sector and stock options aren't a consideration.

For me, it's a matter of advancing a retirement planned for June 2023 to June of this year or perhaps sooner. I was 70 on my last birthday so no one will question retirement, and if the MRD age hadn't been increased I would already have planned to retire this year.

It's normal in my field to give about six months of notice, because hiring is usually from a national pool of applicants who are tied to contracts. In this case, I'm pretty sure, however, that they will try to hire someone local, with no particular qualifications (I have a graduate degree in the field). The work environment has turned toxic and dangerous to me, and I'm not sure that I can survive until June, so I'm looking at February 28.
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"For me, it's a matter of advancing a retirement planned for June 2023 to June of this year or perhaps sooner. I was 70 on my last birthday so no one will question retirement, and if the MRD age hadn't been increased I would already have planned to retire this year.

It's normal in my field to give about six months of notice, because hiring is usually from a national pool of applicants who are tied to contracts. In this case, I'm pretty sure, however, that they will try to hire someone local, with no particular qualifications (I have a graduate degree in the field). The work environment has turned toxic and dangerous to me, and I'm not sure that I can survive until June, so I'm looking at February 28. "

***************************************************************************************

Couple of points -
1) Normal to give 6 months notice. What would the employer give you as far as notice of layoffs?
2) You are 70 - you are OK to retire whenever you please
3) Hiring a replacement. You can always tell the powers that be that you are willing to come
back to help train a replacement - for a suitable fee or stipend.
4) Toxic or dangerous work environment - enough said even if the view is not shared by anyone else
suffering through the problems.
5) February is an absolutely wonderful time to retire. January is OK too. March is known for making
transitions to retired life a good process. April works well for stopping work. May is known to be
truly a growing time for retired folks. June allows you to enter retirement in a warming time.
July - well what can be wrong about retiring in mid-summer? August is especially heart-warming for
retiring. September gets the fall-off from work-a-day life off to a rousing start. October lets
you take a good close look at just how colorful retirement can be. November is pretty snazzy
across the board. And December lets you fully appreciate winter in all it's glory without
worrying about getting called into work on icy or snow-covered streets.

Howie52
I heartily recommend retired life - just in case you had any doubts
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The work environment has turned toxic and dangerous to me, and I'm not sure that I can survive until June, so I'm looking at February 28.

Might as well make it January 28.
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Normal to give 6 months notice. What would the employer give you as far as notice of layoffs?

A layoff is the one thing that would never happen. It didn't happen during the pandemic cashflow crunch in 2020, even though I recommended it.

Might as well make it January 28.

You have a point. I would certainly give a full pay period (half a month) of notice, but I have that much vacation time to use during the period of notice.
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TchrP writes:

The work environment has turned toxic and dangerous to me, and I'm not sure that I can survive until June, so I'm looking at February 28.

I'm always curious just exactly what this means when I read such comments. What is toxic? What is dangerous?

I'm sure there are reasons behind such comments and understand everyone has a hurt button that can get pushed, but I'm always curious just how dramatic words such as dangerous and toxic get used to describe a situation.

BB
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I'm sure there are reasons behind such comments and understand everyone has a hurt button that can get pushed, but I'm always curious just how dramatic words such as dangerous and toxic get used to describe a situation.

To be precise, the bad behavior of the volunteer leaders is triggering PTSD from a worse job 20+ years ago.
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To be precise, the bad behavior of the volunteer leaders is triggering PTSD from a worse job 20+ years ago.

Sounds like time to take some paid sick leave. When that runs out, you can decide to take vacation, or just quit. The accrued vacation time should be paid out in $.

-IGU-
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I don't know much about etiquette, but I have always felt like I should give my employer all the respect and consideration that they give me regarding retirement timing and notice. If they have a history of being ruthless and walking people out as soon as notice is given, then don't give them a second's notice until you are ready to walk out. If they always work with employees to allow them to train replacements and transition to retirement, then work with them to accomplish that.

I suppose if the details of how you leave impact co-workers that you care about, you need to consider that too. But it isn't your job to protect your co-workers.
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I'm always curious just exactly what this means when I read such comments. What is toxic? What is dangerous?

The temporary office location we had at Motorola was across the hall from one of the semiconductor operations. That operation used cyanide (!!) and it had an alarm system in case any cyanide gas was detected. They tested that system once a week. Very loud with flashing red lights and sirens.

The first time they tested it, we all ran outside.
After awhile people started ignoring the alarm, and stayed at their desk working.

Not me. I always scooted outside and stayed there until the alarms stopped.

Now THAT was a toxic work environment.
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I'm sure there are reasons behind such comments and understand everyone has a hurt button that can get pushed, but I'm always curious just how dramatic words such as dangerous and toxic get used to describe a situation.

To be precise, the bad behavior of the volunteer leaders is triggering PTSD from a worse job 20+ years ago.


Thanks for clarifying. Sounds like you have options to remove yourself from the triggers that includes what you mentioned in your previous post about regarding moving up your retirement date.

In the meantime....

Have these volunteer leaders that are involved in bad behavior been reported for their bad behavior and the triggers it is causing? Is there an HR department at your nonprofit?

BB
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The accrued vacation time should be paid out in $.

Depends on the rules about vacation time for both the employer and the state. Not all states require that vacation time be paid, and in those states that don't, not all employers do so.

AJ
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Depends on the rules about vacation time for both the employer and the state.

Didn't know that. Thanks for the correction.

-IGU-
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How can work, or a work place, be toxic?

It might drive you to drink. It might have you returning home after work ready to tear your spouses head off and scream at the kids. It might require therapy to get over it.

How can it be dangerous?

Along with all the ways that OSHA might imagine, it might lead to you getting arrested.
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As a manager, I'd appreciate a heads up in the manner of: "Hey, just so you know, I'm seriously thinking about retiring sometime this year." That at least puts it on my radar. I don't care about the actual date until we're ready to lock it in with HR, but some advance notice so I can plan projects without getting blindsided by unexpected attrition. That said, I like to think of myself as an easygoing manager. The relationship with my employees is that we could discuss plans for someone's planned departure without anyone's feelings getting hurt or asking security to escort someone out of the building.

+1

As a manager, most of the people who have retired from my team have let me know their general intention at least 18 months in advance. The actual date is typically planned ~60 days out. It seems to work well for both sides. No one gets walked out and I can plan/hire a replacement without being a time crunch. Everyone has left on good terms with the door being open both ways to coming back part-time and/or as a contractor.
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"How can work, or a work place, be toxic? ... How can it be dangerous? "

**************************************************************

Quite a few industrial facilities handle dangerous materials routinely - and you see adverts
from lawyers concerning different long-term exposure issues fairly frequently. Handling
insulation, mercury compounds, poisons, and so on literally can make an environment toxic and
dangerous. A portion of my career was spent in haz-op reviews - and there was never a shortage
of potential problems

In other cases, the location of a business or charity can be in dangerous areas. There was a
"hospital" for the criminally insane, as well as two prisons nearby one facility and the
"alarm tests" for "escapes" were a routine upset - competing between the three for
grabbing the most attention.

And there is also the potential for co-workers to be quite alarming as well - sometimes
because of history or attitude or whatever. Bosses can make a position untenable - sometimes
without trying.

Howie52
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Look at Libby Montana and the asbestos problem they have had. A whole town that was toxic because of one employer.

Andy
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Now THAT was a toxic work environment.

Sounds familiar, I was one of the first employees of a new semiconductor foundry being brought online, the first 6 months evacuation alarms went off regularly. We were supposed to exit and run upwind which was almost always impossible because we were fenced in. On the Apollo program we had a fire with caustic chemicals on the craft. Same rules, run up wind but somehow the two wind socks were pointing different directions, two streams of people running different directions all yelling at the others “wrong way”. Engineering can be interesting but not always perfectly safe. Another time a group of coworkers were accidently overexposed to radiation.

Back to the original “how much notice should I give”? I’ll go with 38Packerds -it all depends on your individual situation. I’ve been in toxic situations where they would arbitrarily walk someone out the door with no notice and aware of a place where everyone worked together to the point of sharing the workload of a dying coworker.
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My company doesn't pay it out. Use it or lose it. They'll refund any ESPP or other funds that have not been used yet (e.g. we have two ESPP purchases per year), but sick leave and vacation time are forfeit for exempt employees. Hourly time-card workers do get the pay-out, however.
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I have worked in semiconductors for 28 years. We had a fab on-site (since closed due to age). Yes, we had drills (required by the fire department), and also actual alarms. When that alarm tripped, you left. Nasty, nasty stuff in that fab. I very quickly got in the habit of having my wallet and car keys with me at all times, because if I was in the lab and the alarm tripped, I couldn't go back to my desk. It was straight out the nearest exit. But if I had my keys and wallet, after being "counted" (to make sure everyone got out), I could go grab something to eat. In one case, I just went home because the FD said we weren't going back inside for many hours.

1poorguy
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I once worked in a place where the soles of my steel toed safety shoes dissolved after 3 months.

Dissolved.

Let’s see there were acid pits for rust removal and solvents and lubricants spraying into the air continuously from machines built in the 40s that could turn a solid steel rod into cylinders with nothing but brute force like it was silly putty. The floors were oozy and I smelled like hot machinery every night after work.

Thank goodness I got laid off shortly after my shoes turned to goo.

Circa 1984.
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"I once worked in a place where the soles of my steel toed safety shoes dissolved after 3 months.

Dissolved."

*****************************************************************************

Not all that unusual. Solvents work on soles - now if the steel toes dissolved as well?
That would have been toxic.

Howie52
I worked for a time in a chlorine facility - where special soles were required to take samples
from the electrolytic cells - row and rows of the cells and required walking between the cells
to pull samples of "cell liquor" Chlorine was generated on one side and hydrogen was generated
on the other. Basically, an "uncomfortable" job. But there were worse ones - like making up
the diaphragm liquor to coat the "fresh" cells - basically using asbestos at that time. They've
improved the process a bunch in the decades since I worked at the plant - and closed the plant
I worked at for many years.

Spending any time on a barge being loaded with liquid chlorine was also more fun than any person
should want. The good part of the job was knowing the rats near the barge would be killed by a
spill before they would start nibbling at your toes.
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