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Yes I know you aren't reading this (as evidenced by the huge rec totals that your personal attacks on me render, lol)

Anyway Leftists, take a break from your racist halls of I.T and your resentful cubicles and T.P.S reports for a second, I've got a new assignment for you.

No, you don't have to count the number of cars burned in Paris for New Years, by the oppressed minority. NO, you don't have to go to Obama's Gitmo and replace wafers of chlorine in the urinals.

You've been promoted to high finance! Actuary! Your assignment:

1.)Get together with the other resentful envious jealous Leftists you know and decide: What are you gonna do about the 2% in payroll taxes Obama has told you to pay? Will you cut back on coffee? Porn? Meth? Organic Veggies? Pot? Once you figure that out.....

2.)Think of your boss's boss's boss's boss. Gotta be at least 4 levels higher than the average Bay Area I.T underachiever. Anyway this guy earns $399,999 a year and OBAMA GAVE HIM A BUSH TAX CUT!!!

I'd like you to write that guy a note, suggesting what he should do with the money. After all, YOU are kicking in 2% more, while his marginal rate stayed cut by 4%. He's been inconvenienced for having extra money to have to spend and at very least, you can screen the right hotels and restaurants for him or her.

Should he invest it? Save it? Go on vacation? Buy a boat?

The most creative ideas will get a prize. You get to wear a Hawaiian Shirt next Friday.



JediG
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Well I don't consider myself to be a "leftist" ...but now that you mention it, I probably should cut back on meth a little bit...
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lol.

C'mon Smay. Admit it.

After all the whines on the 'bush tax cuts' and "mitt not caring about regular americans'...

It's kinda funny that Obama kept tax cuts for people earning $399k per year, while making sure everyone else saw a 2% increase in taxes.

JediG
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Also...Happy New year to you my friend! Missed having you around there for awhile! Yes, a complete flat tax guy. Do away with IRS, loopholes, tax codes, and all the other graft that goes with it ;-)
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Wow I didn't know that Smay.

The Flat Tax actually shows the warts of FAKES on both Right and Left.

Those on the Left whine that "the rich don't pay enough" can't stand it because if say, everyone paid a flat 20%... the guy making a million would pay $200,000...while the fellow earning $40,000 would pay $8,000. One would pay 200k, the other would pay 8,000....yet both defended by the same army, both using the same clean air, roads, etc.

Those on the Right who hate "welfare" would say bye-bye to all the corporate loopholes, personal deductions, etc.

And of course, those who worship government and the Ruling Class would be upset, because without the tax code, the government loses the power to do all sorts of things, be it peddle home buying or whatever.

JediG
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Obama...Boehner...they're all in this together. I don't trust any of them. Every person in Washington is out for themselves first...the American people? Pound sand....
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Yes, a complete flat tax guy. Do away with IRS, loopholes, tax codes, and all the other graft that goes with it ;-)

___________

As long as there's a tax, there will be a loopholes and graft. Although a flat tax with zero deductions will reduce that and everyone pays their fair share.


(although you'll have to grandfather some tax free incomes so people who paid the tax upfront aren't screwed. See Roth's and certain Muni Bonds)
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(although you'll have to grandfather some tax free incomes so people who paid the tax upfront aren't screwed. See Roth's and certain Muni Bonds)
______________________________

Every investment comes with risks. Sad but true, changes in government is just one of them.

If you go with this type of thinking, then shouldn't homeowners and owners of REITs get special treatment since their holding just lost value and ......
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Hi Smay I agree with you.

Boehner is just a typical establishment politician, out to please his special interest and sell even more of the country off to those interests...both foreign and domestic.

Obama? I think he's trying to hurt the country on purpose.

American voters? I think obama and boehner are the perfect reflection of "We the People".

JediG
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Every investment comes with risks. Sad but true, changes in government is just one of them.

If you go with this type of thinking, then shouldn't homeowners and owners of REITs get special treatment since their holding just lost value and ......

____________

Nope, no deductions. If your investments lose money then you don't have any taxes to pay.

It has to be even across the board. The only reason to grandfather investments currently tax free is because they made with that promise. (although I know the government can change their mind on that and start taxing them at anytime).

No special treatments for anyone. 15% across the board starting at $10,000 per year. That's it, no FICA no Medicare nothing else. One tax to cover everything. No more nickle and diming with various taxes.
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Anyway Leftists, take a break from your racist halls of I.T and your resentful cubicles and T.P.S reports for a second, I've got a new assignment for you.

Since when did IT people become racists?


Grape <- IT guy
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It has to be even across the board. The only reason to grandfather investments currently tax free is because they made with that promise. (although I know the government can change their mind on that and start taxing them at anytime).
______________________________

Are they made with a promise?

Can you find the part that says, we guarantee that you will never pay a federal tax? Or is it implied by belief? Like Social Security etc. I do not know the answer, 'there are no federal taxes' is ambiguous, there can never be any federal taxes that would be differnt. Just as there will never be an income tax taken will be no longer valid, as it will not be an income tax, it will be a general revenue tax.

There are no real promises only beliefs. IF is it actually written in the contract/offering then indeed someone should not pay, although as GM bondholders found out government does not always believe in contract law.

There are all kinds of promises that people believe have been made, that do not exist. The citizen's contract with government is far far more tenuous than most realize, and more tenuos than even those who do recognize are willing to admit in general.
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Are they made with a promise?

_________

Yes, you invest in a Roth IRA/401K because the law says you don't get a deduction now because you won't pay income tax on the money earned when you retire. I'd consider that a promise.

And when the time comes that Obama-philes (probably after his reign is over) have more control, they'll start going after money most people believed were safe.

That's why I still invest in a traditional 401K as well as the Roth. I want my deductions today, because while I hope the Roth will be tax free when I retire. I'm not prepared to go all in and lose deductions today.

Politicians make a lot of promises...don't trust any of them.
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Yes, you invest in a Roth IRA/401K because the law says you don't get a deduction now because you won't pay income tax on the money earned when you retire. I'd consider that a promise.
_________________________________

Exactly, and I bought a house based on the fact that the person who buts it from me will get a mortgage deduction. Making the price I was willing to pay higher

People voted for politicians over decades based on 65 being retirement age

the list goes on and on and on and on and on

There was no contract so no promise, just a we intend.

Time for folks to understand that. You want some sacred thing in your mind to be sacrosanct yet others assumptions? Well they should have known better.
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Promises are made...promises are broken. It's that simple.
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Hi grape....

Not all.

Some for sure.

If you didn't despise me I'd email you real living examples, right off this board for proof.

JediG << burger eating guy
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Yet another thread where ideas are discussed.

Better than the typical Liberal thread...

"I was drafted so I'm more special than others. Now my life kinda sucks so I lash out at Republicans and rich people"

JediG
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Hi grape....

Not all.

Some for sure.


Well you used a broad brush in your characterization.

If you didn't despise me I'd email you real living examples, right off this board for proof.

I don't despise anyone. You seem to be projecting. Perhaps you can point to a post where I somehow attacked you? I don't recall ever getting into an exchange that would lead you to make that statement.


Grape
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Grape, like I said, not everyone.

Sorry for the broad brush. Just kinda part of the game here with "Republicans are scum" and everything.

I'm projecting nothing.

How much more blunt can I be than to openly say "Haha, this sucks and lol@ you morons"? to the lib minions here

JediG
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Grape, like I said, not everyone.

Sorry for the broad brush. Just kinda part of the game here with "Republicans are scum" and everything.


Okay, but I'm wondering why you're singling out the IT profession.

I'm projecting nothing.

How much more blunt can I be than to openly say "Haha, this sucks and lol@ you morons"? to the lib minions here


I'm not sure what that has to do with your assessment that I somehow despise you. Do you think I'm a liberal perhaps?


Grape
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decide: What are you gonna do about the 2% in payroll taxes Obama has told you to pay?

It's returned to exactly what it was 2 years ago as it was temporary tax relief for the middle class and working poor during the recession. Time's up! And no problem (er, especially not for us as DH retired as of Jan 1, although you might not believe that taxes had not a thing to do with that decision ;-)
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Sorry for the broad brush. Just kinda part of the game here with "Republicans are scum" and everything.

I don't think Republicans are scum. I just think they're wrong. (I may lose my cool on occasion, however ;-)

Also... you said something about everyone being protected by the same army, etc. But...rich people are getting much more property protected, so they should pay more, yes?
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After all, YOU are kicking in 2% more, while his marginal rate stayed cut by 4%. He's been inconvenienced for having extra money to have to spend and at very least, you can screen the right hotels and restaurants for him or her.

Silly little ranter.

Is this the best straw man you could construct? Pretty weak.

Fact is, the guy you applaud, whose wealth went up more rapidly during the Bush tax cuts than the guy you hate -- meaning all IT people and all liberals -- has to pay the extra 2%, too.

And, that person is not getting a tax cut he hasn't already been receiving, so while, admittedly, $2000 more in payroll taxes won't hurt him, he will have less cash, not more.

As for the people you hate, they will also not see a tax hike on their income. Thus, this is a flat tax increase, which surprises me that you would oppose.

Maybe this year we can raise the FICA application to $400,000 from its current $110K level.

BTW Jedi, maybe you don't understand the niceties of American government, but the law that was passed was a compromise, with all the people who voted for it accepting something they didn't like. Obama accepted the FICA increase, but didn't want it.

Its so easy to sit on the sidelines and pout and huff and puff and anonymously throw vicious insults at people you never met and know nothing about, and justify it by saying they are racists and hypocrites, unlike, I guess, you. Its another thing to get in the arena and try to do something.

Which is why most politicians, even people like Boehner, are far more noble than people who just like to attack them personally, rather than critique their policies.
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Also... you said something about everyone being protected by the same army, etc. But...rich people are getting much more property protected, so they should pay more, yes?


Haven't you heard? The rich have all their money in the Cayman Islands. I don't think our army is protecting the Caymans.
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HI alstro...

That right there is perhaps my ONLY beef with your outlook on things.

You've got too much of "the rich this, the rich that".

Ok, let the Rich pay more towards the army cause they have more property.

but then let the poor pay for welfare. Let the rich totally withdraw from Social Security and Medicare, let everyone else pay for that. Let the rich send their kids to private school, but then refund the rich the "per pupil" cost that their kids won't be using at public school. Of course, since the "rich" are paying more for the army to defend their extra 3 acres of backyard, the rich should get their property tax refunded too. Let the condo owner fund public school with $2000 property tax bills while the rich save their $15,000 in the same zip code, see how it works. Then let's make sure everyone pays the equal dollar amount for infrastructure. The rich guy in his Cadillac and the working man each drive the same freeway at rush hour. One car. One butt. Let em pay equal income tax as far as that is concerned.

See Alstro, we're both good keyboard warriors. We can both do well at a P*ssing match on why the rich should pay more or less. It'd be tic tac toe and neither of us would ever win.

Back when I cared, my heartbreak was that there was too much "the rich this the rich that" whereas in the America I grew up in, if we saw a Cadillac on the road or whatever, our teachers, scoutmasters, whatever would say "do your homework and work hard and you can have that just like that man has". Heck my parents were 1st generation immigrants. Dad earned $40k most of his life in corporate mid-management. Mom ran a home day-care with 6 kids, probably took in 22k. They saved every dime they had but eventually bought a small business, the whole family worked it, and yes, they retired part of that evil top 1%. In the Old America where envy was less, and PHD's were more, people excelled. (Pride, Hustle, and Desire, that's my PHD) We're just too envious now. I'm all for curtailing loopholes for EVERYONE. Let's all play by the same rules. And let's have an AMERICAN mentality of getting ahead, rather than trying to find a least common denominator for everyone.

See now you got me nostalgic as if I gave a crap about anything! Darn you :) I'm going to go back to playing with my pets here. Surely there's some bad news that came out in the past few hours.

Cheese pizza and potato skins for lunch. Courtesy of my unemployment income. Gotta love Obama 2012

JediG
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Hi Cairo....

Origami Expert.

Can transform a Save Tibet shirt into a bedsheet with eye-holes in under 30 seconds. You are a you-tube sensation.

Now go back to work.

Pay my unemployment.

Pay your FICA.

Someone making $399k needs your 2% so they can have their Obama tax cut.

As far as the rest of your attack, keep attacking. Racist, jealous, ranter you are.

In the arena? I've forgotten more about the arena than you'll ever learn about the arena, lol.

Progressive America: Tax cut for the $399k crowd, 2% FICA hike for everyone.

Go on, attack me. It'll cost you billions in debt per attack, and one burnt car in Paris at least! Recs you can keep. I'll keep the current events.

Obama 2012
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The Caymans and the Switzerland stuff is over.

Those who truly wanted to say "up yours" to these mooches knew it long ago, and got wise and sophisticated about using cash, bartering, setting up 'break-even' businesses overseas where no taxable income is shown, etc.Now those same people would get $378 per week in unemployment, another $98,345 in rental income, and pay ZERO Federal Income Taxes, legally.

While the schlep in San Fran jacks around with his I.T platform eating his alfalfa sprouts, lol.

Of course, nobody on this board would do that stuff.

LOL
(And nobody, for a small fee would get together with small business owners in Metro Detroit who are from Iraq, and educate them on how to cut their tax bill....ie by sticking the wife on Payroll for $12,000 per year and 401k'ing her income....or by buying the property their liquor store sits on, and using an LLC to charge higher rent to the liquor store, but then making their kids "managers" of the LLC who get paid, and then get taxed at a much lower rate. And nobody on this board would be on a 1st name basis with Najwa, Riyadh, Sammy, Amal, Ikhlas, because he did just a good job helping them keep their money out of the hands of mooch Liberals. And nobody would take insults he got on a message board, and use that as motivation to help over 20 hardworking immigrant families minimize their tax bill. And help 6 foreign students not only attend grad school at Duke, but help them with lawyers to get permanent residency to work in fields populated by Liberals. If anybody ever did that, they'd be part nuts, part spiteful of bigoted Bay Area butts, and part...well, genius!)


Obama 2012

JediG
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Jedi, your response is summed up in your own words, and approach:

keep attacking. Racist, jealous, ranter you are.

I don't pay anything of yours. My country does, if indeed you get anything, and then you get it because you are like everyone else in your situation -- why you think that entitles you to racist, jealous, nasty rants is beyond me.

Better than living in India though, eh?
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Kitty Cat Cairo kees clinging to my every word. Then lashing out.

And I'm entertained by it, hence I keep baiting the cat.

Sorry Racist, say what you like. You're not relevant. Well, other than, get to work. We need your fica TAXES.

Why do you keep bringing up India with me? What does this thread, or any other thread have to do with India?

It's cause when you talk to me, you see a brown person. An ethnicity you don't like. I don't care. You've been defeated so many times in history. Whether you were the British Empire killing brown people. Or when you blocked a high school to keep out black people. Or when you put those women on trial for being witches, or when you signed a constitution that didn't let women vote. In the end you lost every time.

And this time, you've lost forever.

Hence all you have is lashing out at me.

While I keep baiting you more.

C;mon grand dragon Cairo! More irrelevant hate towards me! Bring up things that have nothing to do with the topic at hand.

More! Do more!

If you're gonna bring out the firehose at least warn me. I got a raincoat.

JediG
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Haven't you heard? The rich have all their money in the Cayman Islands. I don't think our army is protecting the Caymans.

Don't be too sure!
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Why do you think that people who want justice and fairness are envious? Actually, I wish I had a smaller house! (cheaper and faster to heat, cool, clean, maintain, pay taxes on) And less stuff! (I have to periodically winnow it--what a pain) While I agree that my brother's Hyundai Genesis is more awesome to drive than any car I've ever owned, I wouldn't want to buy one even though I can afford it. There are other discretionary items/experiences that are of more value to me...attending performances, buying pastured beef, taking art classes...and the Genesis takes premium gas--ick.

My heart breaks more for the poor than the rich.
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Hi Alstro....

I didn't say that people want justice and fairness are envious.


Please quote me and link to my post where I said those words.

(I will say, that there are folks here who are very envious. And they mask their envy in compassion)


Why do you love terrorists because you might be against waterboarding?

See Alstro? We can all be cute phrasing words and definitions where they are really not a fair and accurate portrayal.

It's great your heart breaks for the poor and it's true compassion that you can tell everyone that on a public message board.

Hopefully you can refund the poor's payroll tax increase that obama just put thru while preserving tax cuts for someone earning 399k.

jediG
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Oh Jedi, you little narrow-minded bigot, spouting your hatred of anyone not like you, for years now. Happy when you offend and outrage. You don't know who I am or what I stand for, though it is not for the resentment, envy, class bias, selfishness and bigotry of you -- not because of your skin, but because of your ideas, your mind, the gnawing anger that you voice without relenting against whole classes of people you imagine are out there who you think hold these views about you. Classic paranoia. Classic irrational prejudice. Classical bigotry. All in one Jedi.

I don't hate people of color -- I don't even hate you, but I am disgusted by you. And offended. if that gives you pleasure, it says a lot about you, not about me. I am sorry that all your negative experiences in life have so soured and twisted you that you feel driven to spew your resentment and anger non-stop.

What I note about this little screed is its evidence of ignorance, arrogance, and lack of self-insight. By your lights, if my skin is white, then I hold all the sins of white people against people of color, while you, as a person of color, soak up all their victimhood. And have no responsibility for the past sins of people of your color. What an open mind you have!

I think hate is a negative, and your irrelevant hatred, which is all you post, has nothing to do with the topic at hand. But you'll never see that.
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My heart breaks more for the poor than the rich.

I guess you never watched the TV show Dallas or Dynasty...

99
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I think hate is a negative, and your irrelevant hatred, which is all you post, has nothing to do with the topic at hand. But you'll never see that.

LMFAO!

No one hates like a baited bottom feeder stuck on the hook.

99
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