No. of Recommendations: 2
Who's to blame?

According to this guy, it falls on the Presidents lack of leadership...

"A shutdown falls on the President's lack of leadership.
He can't even control his party and get people together in a room.
A shutdown means the President is weak." ~Donald Trump, the dumbest President in US history

The failure keeps on failing...

#PutinsPuppet

Now get back to posting about Hillary's Emails!
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No. of Recommendations: 14
you mean the Pelosi Schumer Shut Down?

They have the ability to show their BI-PARTISANSHIP and NEGOTIATE a deal.

Instead, they are the party of 'no negotiations' , no compromise, and just no no no


t.
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No. of Recommendations: 9
you mean the Pelosi Schumer Shut Down?

They have the ability to show their BI-PARTISANSHIP and NEGOTIATE a deal.

Instead, they are the party of 'no negotiations' , no compromise, and just no no no


Oh, they are QUITE willing to vote funding for a border wall to keep out criminals and terrorists... as long as at least one of the following three conditions is true:

* no major Republicans are asking for one

* it isn't for the US border

* it's tied with a bad idea that's even more expensive.
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No. of Recommendations: 2
Of course you totally ignored your hero's own words...

"A shutdown falls on the President's lack of leadership.
He can't even control his party and get people together in a room.
A shutdown means the President is weak." ~Donald Trump, the dumbest President in US history

Trump says Trump is a weak President!

The failure keeps on failing...

#PutinsPuppet
#BoneSpursVonDimwit
#AlertTheDaycareStaff
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No. of Recommendations: 5
t:

"Negotiate" a deal? C'mon, man. Trump said up front this would be HIS shutdown and he will NOT negotiate. He wants his damned wall or else.

Sorry, but no deal. And he should be ashamed, with Coast Guard people and all manner of elderly and kids affected.

Trump is the most uncaring, self-centered, immature, narcissistic a**hole ever elected.

Vermonter
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No. of Recommendations: 13
Trump has been clear that border security is a top priority, with a record 107,000 apprehensions of illegals in 2018. Who are these people? CNN and MSNBC wants us to believe their all doe-eyed innocents. But how many are agents of drug cartels to serve as their employees in drug trafficking in the US? Street heroin prices, at least around here, are at record lows, suggesting deep infiltration of handlers, distributors, transporters etc...just as would be case with any manufactured product. How many are violent criminals escaping their own country's police? How many working for terror cells? The answer is we don't know. This is a top priority....the Nancy & Chuck team know this but they don't give a damn. When your children/grandchildren come home with needle marks, will you then pay attention.

The President is acting responsibly and strongly, unlike any of this predecessors who would never have this level of political will. He has offered to meet halfway....but Nancy and Chuck's concern...their ONLY CONCERN...is defeating Trump policies and efforts, whatever the cost born by whomever. They simply don't care.

BruceM
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No. of Recommendations: 1
What was the longest shutdown ever... before this one?
And did it get as much attention as this one?
Just curious

RayB
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No. of Recommendations: 2
What seems to be overlooked by the wall proponents is that 80% or more of the "illegal" drugs and other things come into our country by means of traffic on roads and in airplanes and boats -- in other words, through pathways that pass through or around or over the wall. The wall won't really amount to anything serious in terms of slowing that traffic.

And, of course, people will find ways to go over and under the wall.

Vermonter
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No. of Recommendations: 2
BruceCM:

Have you noticed how much of the "terror" we seem to face in this country comes from homegrown, often white folks -- "Americans", if you will?
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No. of Recommendations: 10
80% or more of the "illegal" drugs and other things come into our country by means of traffic on roads and in airplanes and boats

people will find ways to go over and under the wall.


So, perhaps we should tear down all of the existing wall, including between San Diego and Tiguana?? It wouldn't matter...right??

Nonsense! Walls work to keep out those who are trying to enter illegally for whatever reason that drives them. None of these who are rushing the barriers are carrying back-packs of drugs...I'm sure most drugs do arrive by other means. But its gotten harder for drug cartel employees to come through using 'traditional' paths as BPA and ICE find their methods and catch them. So it makes perfect sense that disguising as doe-eyed innocents climbing a wall 'for a better life' amongst those who are indeed in search of a better life, is most likely the most effective way of getting drug operators in the US.

Non-breechable barriers along the border where foot traffic is highest risk, makes perfect sense. This combined with sensing technology means border agents can spend their time elsewhere for the best border security mix.

BruceM
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No. of Recommendations: 4
Trump has been clear that border security is a top priority

Really? He had 2 years of Republicans controlled congress. If it is top priority, what was he doing in the last 2 years?
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No. of Recommendations: 8
Really? He had 2 years of Republicans controlled congress. If it is top priority, what was he doing in the last 2 years? - Kingran

--------------------

Apparently you never heard of the filibuster rule in the Senate. Google it. It's fun to learn.
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No. of Recommendations: 9
"The wall won't really amount to anything serious in terms of slowing that traffic.

And, of course, people will find ways to go over and under the wall."


You may be right about the drugs flow however, the purpose of the wall is to restrict the flow of ...illegal...people into this country. A barrier will clearly slow down this influx of unknown/unidentified people entering ...illegally... into the US.
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No. of Recommendations: 1
Apparently you never heard of the filibuster rule in the Senate.

Interesting, republicans have never put a bill for voting till Dec 2018, if I am not mistaken. There were other budget maneuvering done to overcome the filibuster. If it is really priority they could have got it done. After all the corporate tax cut was passed without a single democratic vote and one republican voting against it.

I don't think it is because of the votes, even republicans didn't believe in it. Now, it is all politics. Both sides have established their position and not going to budge.

What is real funny is American congress cannot get its budget act together and they are telling various countries on how to run their finance.
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No. of Recommendations: 1
"So, perhaps we should tear down all of the existing wall, including between San Diego and Tiguana?? It wouldn't matter...right??"

Fallacy of false choice arguments are not very credible.
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No. of Recommendations: 1
So, perhaps we should tear down all of the existing wall, including between San Diego and Tiguana??




What's a Tiguana? A Mexican tiger who smokes pot?
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No. of Recommendations: 6
<Non-breechable barriers along the border where foot traffic is highest risk, makes perfect sense. This combined with sensing technology means border agents can spend their time elsewhere for the best border security mix.>


All of what you say is logical. To me it actually falls into the realm of common sense.

It boggles the mind that people on the other side refuse to concede that walls in fact do work. The idea of tearing down existing walls and just letting everyone who wants to come in anytime they want is absolutely insane. Some of the states that push for such lunacy are places where their budgets are already strained to the limits. Inviting in millions more people who will heavily drain existing resources is a fast path to a financial death spiral.

The wall in all its forms is not meant to be 100% effective. It is meant to provide friction. IOW, it puts a meaningful impediment in the way of those who are intent on committing an illegal act. They may well take on the added burden of trying another means of accomplishing their goal. Many or most will not.

Once built, more technological resources including drones can be used to monitor the border. This allows your human resources to be assigned to where they would be most effective. Some of the improved allocation would help to improve the catch rates on the regular border passages. It will only work if there is an honest desire to fix the problem. Yet Pelosi and her crew seem determined to oppose this simply for the sake of opposing it. There is certainly not a morality play involved in this.

The democratic congresswomen from the San Antonio area is not only against building new walls. She has called for the existing wall in SA to come down. One only needs to look at the stark differences between the San Antonio side of the wall and the Juarez, Mexico side. Talk about the tale of two cities. Violent crime, including so many murders is the rule of the day in Juarez. San Antonio is a relatively peaceful place. It is also an Hispanic majority city. But the congresswomen sees this as a racist policy. I do not see how keeping the wall in place is racist. Once again, ethnicity is not a race. These arguments are never on the merits. They are always about making a sideshow. The media will never report honestly on these matters as long as the stupidity is coming from people on their side.



BG
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No. of Recommendations: 3
" One only needs to look at the stark differences between the San Antonio side of the wall and the Juarez, Mexico side."

Uh...er...hmmm...you mean El Paso, don't you? San Antonio is 600 miles to the east of Juarez. Other than that your observation is on target.

RayB
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No. of Recommendations: 4
Uh...er...hmmm...you mean El Paso, don't you? San Antonio is 600 miles to the east of Juarez. Other than that your observation is on target.

RayB


-----------------

The congresswoman may have been talking about tearing down the racist wall surrounding the Alamo. After all it only kept the army of General Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna out for thirteen days thus proving walls are ineffective.
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No. of Recommendations: 3
As they stood on the ramparts of the Alamo and gazed out at the thousands
of Mexicans approaching the fort, Davy Crockett turned to Jim Bowie and said,
"Jim, do we have landscaping scheduled for today?"

RayB
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No. of Recommendations: 0
My bad!!!

I should not have relied on my memory. I should have pulled up a map before writing.

I would have expected Tele to be the first one to correct me.<g>



BG
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No. of Recommendations: 8
The congresswoman may have been talking about tearing down the racist wall surrounding the Alamo. After all it only kept the army of General Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna out for thirteen days thus proving walls are ineffective.

Betcha the Chinese never would've built The Great Wall if they knew it was immoral. I never knew that inanimate objects could be immoral until this debate. Who knew?
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No. of Recommendations: 0
The wall won't really amount to anything serious in terms of slowing that traffic.

And, of course, people will find ways to go over and under the wall.


They wont's be going under a sheet pile wall...

MR
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No. of Recommendations: 1

It boggles the mind that people on the other side refuse to concede that walls in fact do work.




Walls don't work.

Nearly 400 Migrants Tunnel Under Border Wall to Enter United States from Mexico

https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2019-01-1...

Border Patrol and its parent agency, Customs and Border Protection, this week said that 376 people crossed beneath the barrier, most by traveling through seven tunnels – each only a few feet long – that were dug by smugglers.

"They dug under the fence," National Border Patrol Council President Brandon Judd told CNN. "Unlike most areas along the border, Yuma has some very sandy areas that is easy to dig in."




How embarrassed you must be.
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No. of Recommendations: 1
Once built, more technological resources including drones can be used to monitor the border.



In the near future, drones can be used to carry people over the wall.
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No. of Recommendations: 7
Walls don't work. - Feedmecrap

Nearly 400 Migrants Tunnel Under Border Wall to Enter United States from Mexico

https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2019-01-1......

Border Patrol and its parent agency, Customs and Border Protection, this week said that 376 people crossed beneath the barrier, most by traveling through seven tunnels – each only a few feet long – that were dug by smugglers.

"They dug under the fence," National Border Patrol Council President Brandon Judd told CNN. "Unlike most areas along the border, Yuma has some very sandy areas that is easy to dig in."


-------------------

If there were more barriers along other parts of the border, then the CBP agents would be spread less thin and might have detected the tunnels sooner thus reducing the illegal flow.

Or perhaps some of the thousands of new agents included in Trumps border security proposal might have caught them.

Then the tunnel rats could be detained in some of the thousands of new detention beds included in Trumps border security proposal.

If they needed medical attention, they could have been treated with some of the $800 million of new humanitarian assistance included in Trumps border security proposal.

Rather than being released into the countryside, the illegals could have a prompt court hearing in one of the hundreds of new immigration courts included in Trumps border security proposal.

Walls by themselves don't solve the problem. That is why Trumps border security proposal has all these other elements in it.

Meanwhile, the Pelosi plan is "Not one dollar for a wall". That's it, nothing else, just the "No wall security plan". That is what doesn't work. But you knew that already.
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No. of Recommendations: 2
Meanwhile, the Pelosi plan is "Not one dollar for a wall". That's it, nothing else, just the "No wall security plan". That is what doesn't work. But you knew that already.

Actually, that's not true. The Pelosi plans contains many elements - just NOT a wall.

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/08/683230863/transcript-trumps-a...

The fact is: We all agree we need to secure our borders, while honoring our values: we can build the infrastructure and roads at our ports of entry; we can install new technology to scan cars and trucks for drugs coming into our nation; we can hire the personnel we need to facilitate trade and immigration at the border; we can fund more innovation to detect unauthorized crossings.

Frankly, I have yet to hear Mr. Trump propose anything OTHER than a wall. What else is he proposing??
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No. of Recommendations: 10
Actually, that's not true. The Pelosi plans contains many elements - just NOT a wall. - Kwigley

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/08/683230863/transcript-trumps-a......

The fact is: We all agree we need to secure our borders, while honoring our values: we can build the infrastructure and roads at our ports of entry; we can install new technology to scan cars and trucks for drugs coming into our nation; we can hire the personnel we need to facilitate trade and immigration at the border; we can fund more innovation to detect unauthorized crossings.


OK, that will help, lets do that too!

Frankly, I have yet to hear Mr. Trump propose anything OTHER than a wall. What else is he proposing?? - kwigley

I provided a list of all the things in Trumps proposal besides the "wall" in my post.
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No. of Recommendations: 3
The real question is, why were all of these leftists arguing IN FAVOR of IMMORALITY up until Trump made the wall a central issue in his primary, and then general election, campaign.

Tearing a fetus out of its mother's womb is fine, but defending the integrity of our border is immoral.

Do you really need to know anything else about the values of the Left?
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No. of Recommendations: 9
"Frankly, I have yet to hear Mr. Trump propose anything OTHER than a wall. What else is he proposing?? - kwigley"

Of course you have to ask, because you haven't bothered to listen to what he has said, read the actual proposals, or done anything else to break out of your self-imposed cocoon. The world and the USA are much bigger than CNN - get out and experience it.
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No. of Recommendations: 3
"Of course you have to ask, because you haven't bothered to listen to what he has said, read the actual proposals, or done anything else to break out of your self-imposed cocoon."

Irony of ironies.

No.

The reason he had to ask is because Trump has promised lots of things. None of which have come true. How is his healthcare proposal coming along? How has his proposal to have Mexico pay for the wall gone? Maybe you are one of the sheple who thinks North Korea has actually given up their nukes.

Do you enjoy constantly getting conned? Just how many bridges in Brooklyn do you think you own?
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No. of Recommendations: 8
It's the Pelosi Schumer Shutdown. The party of NO NO NO...

NO compromise

NO bi-partisan ship.

Nothing.
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No. of Recommendations: 3

It's the Pelosi Schumer Shutdown. The party of NO NO NO...

NO compromise

NO bi-partisan ship.

Nothing."


You meant Know Nothing," right?

RayB
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No. of Recommendations: 10
<<Do you enjoy constantly getting conned? Just how many bridges in Brooklyn do you think you own?>>



So?

Life is hard. You find that surprising, I suppose?


And I have EVERY reason to continue to support Trump ---- he kept leftists out of the White House. That merits election all by itself.



Seattle Pioneer
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Yuge
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I WISH Trump would say: This can has been kicked down the road by our Congress for 30 years. The democrats statement that they would negotiate after the shutdown is lifted is absolute hogwash.

I truly don't understand what's going on other than the fact that they will not give Trump any success they can sabotage. McCain (who lost his mind over the last few years) previously clearly stated that he would not vote for immigration reform until the border was secured. Then HE changed his mind about border security I suspect because he, also, hated Trump. (the crack Trump made about him was really foolish). The Republicans, again, shot themselves in the foot by squandering their majority with the help of those like Jeff Flake stopping him from accomplishing things that were good for the country. Glad they all have their priorities straight. It's truly hard to believe that even the far left democrats are serious about totally open borders. How about we take all the poor people in India, China and all of South America? Is there a number that even they think would be excessive?

Saw an interesting map the other day that showed that the entire state of California already has a wall. Seems to end right at the Arizona border. Maybe we could tear that down, place it on the border between California and the rest of the country and finish the rest of the wall. California then could truly become the sanctuary state.
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No. of Recommendations: 6
I think a better idea would be to round up as many buses as Trump's folks can come up with, take them to the border, get a booming loudspeaker to tell the hordes to load into the buses for free passage into the US, then with them loaded like an India Indian bus, drive them all up I5, split the 20 mile bus train in two: half take the exit into downtown San Francisco and the other half to downtown Palo Alto, and unload them there. Continue this circle until every occupant south of the Rio Grande who wishes entry into the US has been transported.

Next, get the funding for a wall to surround CA.

I wonder what Nancy (Latte) Pelosi would think of that.

BruceM
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No. of Recommendations: 5
"Negotiate" a deal? C'mon, man. Trump said up front this would be HIS shutdown and he will NOT negotiate. He wants his damned wall or else.

And many of us back him 100% on this. The only reason the left does not is because those illegal immigrants are the only thing keeping California a Dam state.



Trump is the most uncaring, self-centered, immature, narcissistic a**hole ever elected.

Oh, NOT EVEN CLOSE!!!! We got Bill Clinton and Barack Obama that are light years ahead of him in that regard.
Even the people that LIKE them call them narcissists.

Kathleen
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No. of Recommendations: 5
What seems to be overlooked by the wall proponents is that 80% or more of the "illegal" drugs and other things come into our country by means of traffic on roads and in airplanes and boats -- in other words, through pathways that pass through or around or over the wall. The wall won't really amount to anything serious in terms of slowing that traffic.


Oh, since it won't stop 100% we shouldn't do anything. Do you take that attitude with your home? Somehow, I doubt it.

Kathleen
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Fallacy of false choice arguments are not very credible.


omg,... I am laughing so hard over the irony of that post that it's hard to breathe!!

Kathleen
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